The Truth and The Lie Are Set Up Side by Side

I’ve been writing for several years now, exposing the false signs and wonders of Charismania that has taken over the church. This movement has come from many sources, mine were the International Association of Healing Rooms, heavily influenced by Bill Johnson, Bethel, in Redding, CA, and a long list of names and teachers to go along, including Heidi Baker of Iris Ministries, John Paul Jackson of Streams Ministries. I operated in the false prophetic, laid hands on people, zapping them with strange electrical power that did nothing but knock them (and me) around. I think most of you know my past, so I won’t rehash it just now. It is important that you understand the power was quite real, quite dramatic, and just as all sin is for a time, quite fun. I watched as I felt that presence go from warm and comforting, to electrical and painful, even scary at times.

I have found the greatest doctrinal error in those groups was the misunderstanding of the Holy Spirit and how He operates in the lives of believers and in the lives of unbelievers. He has a very specific part to play and He does not work in the life of a believer in the same way He does an unbeliever. One thing that I will note which is a very important foundational knowledge:

John 16:12“I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come. 14He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to

you.

For better clarification and to alleviate misunderstood doctrine regarding the Holy Spirit, please read the words of Jesus as He explains Him to His disciples in John 14, 15, 16. If everyone did that I wouldn’t be writing this article and charsimania would never have existed.

I want you to keep this in mind as you watch the videos that follow. I believe this movie made by Darren Wilson (Finger of God, Father of Lights) will play a large role in further deceiving the masses, first believers and then unbelievers. Darren’s previous movies clearly displayed the false signs and lying wonders of fallen manna and gold teeth mysteriously appearing in the mouths of people. Darren, like many of us, wanted to see more of God – more power, more healings, more miracles and so he opened himself up to the god of charismania. This movie is just another false idea that we need to be in a specific place to receive in truth was freely given for the asking. All of charismania believes there are specific places where God “shows up”. This is not the teaching of the New Testament.

I experienced the power they speak of in this movie attributed to the work of the Holy Spirit. I experience the lying wonders. And though they use His title (just as they use the name of Jesus) they do not know Him, nor do they speak for, or of Him. The power behind this movie is the same power behind Charismania. It is demonic. It is not Jesus.

The few of the people involved in this movie: Michael W Smith, Heidi Baker, Bill Johnson, Randy Clark, Andrew Wommack, Todd White and Kim Walker. Darren has made a plea to the public to get involved too. Word of mouth advertising is most effective. I hope those of us who speak the truth will do the same and get the truth out there.

The following link comes from Charisma -

Holy Ghost Movie

Yes, I am greatly disturbed and grieved. This is probably the hardest article I have written since the beginning of my blog. I have seen things go from bad to worse. People, we cannot have the power of the Holy Spirit without repentance! Bethel and IAHR, and all the rest, believe it is a force that can be passed off from one person to another, by way of impartation. It is not repentance they are after. It is the power.

The following video is a collection on Brian Welch of Korn. Brian is in the Holy Ghost movie and claims to know Christ. He left Korn, formed his own band, then returned to Korn. He pals around with John Crowder; is depicted in the last part of the video with Todd Bentley and Patricia King doing their usual false prophetic thing in telling Brian, like they tell everyone, how great an influence he will be.

I have to warn you this video can get quite graphic but you need to know, the world needs to know who is taking part in the Holy Ghost movie. As for repentance, where is Christ beyond the use of His name? Again, caution in viewing.

This is a more “intimate” video further revealing the euphoric, drunken, even sexual influence of the demon referred to as “jesus”. We are not seeing this for the first time. We  will not find the disciples describe Jesus, the Messiah, in such a way in the pages of the bible.

By now you are seeing many things. An important point that we want to remember is in all of this, is the focus is not put on Christ, it is put on the person – fame and fortune, a bit of word of faith prosperity. Christ calls us to repent and to turn from our sin. We are called out from the world.

I believe there is a reason the music world has been pulled into this deception and I will get into that another time.

You see how the truth and the lie have been set up side by side.

The first release is scheduled for August 9.

Other reads:

It’s All Been a Set Up

Holy Spirit Manifestations

 

 

 

 

 

Escape the Lie, An Interview

Looky what just “escaped” from the internet:

Escape From Bethel

______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

The website containing my interview is no longer in operation. Just “poof” and it is no longer there, along with the contact e-mail. Not sure if it will be available. Just will wait and see. Sorry all.

Here is the audio of an interview I did this morning exposing the trap and darkness of “Bethel”.

Pass it on.

A former “Seer Prophet” tells her story and helps to expose the false teachings of Bill Johnson, Todd Bentley, John Paul Jackson and others. The Healing Rooms and Word of Faith ministries

It has been brought to my attention that his other site supports AA and 12 Stepping, Celebrate Recovery. I understand these practices to not be of God and I am not condoning or supporting them in any way. I believe Christ is enough. You will find links of supporting information against these programs from My Word Like Fire in the comments section for more info on these topics. It is only my intention, as it has been since the beginning of my blogging days, to support Christianity in it’s true form, as found written in the word of God.

An Act of Well Honed Manipulation

Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour. 1 Peter 5:8

Proper exegesis, proper hermeneutics comes from time well spent in careful study. As a society we have enmassed a wealth of resources and information, and live in an information age, as answers to our questions are literally at our fingertips.

As Christians, we have the promised guidance of truth and revelation through the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. We have the written word of God which confirms truth to us as we study. Discernment is a gift, but it comes with understanding how it operates.  Surely we are a people who are able to spot a manipulator no matter how well-honed he appears. We are called to think soberly and to judge righteously, speaking against all teaching not supportive in scripture.

If you believe the man in the following video, Bill Johnson, is speaking through the presence and revelation of the Holy Spirit, if you believe the things said here are prophetic, you will just as easily believe the one who is to come claiming to be Christ – yet is not – the one who will fulfill the prophecy of Matthew 24 and sits on the throne. He too will perform great signs and wonders.

The deception and falling away from Christ will come that easily for you.

Why?

This man is a liar, and he is not a prophetic man of God, and these manifestations of signs and wonders as God’s presence and God’s blessing on His people are not found in the bible, which makes them false signs and wonders! Yet, he speaks as a man from God, so remember Christ said many would come in His name and would be deceived.

Christ also said that He would not leave us as orphans!  It is the desire of God for us to known Him through Christ, not feathers and dust, but  through repentance as sinners, gaining knowledge through His word – Jesus is the Word – and written, the confirmation of our faith!  He does not drop feathers. He does not rain down gold dust or appear as smoke.

Wasn’t the death of Christ enough for you to believe?  If not, you never will.

Nothing God does is offensive to us because we are in agreement with all that He says and does. Christ died for us. We are repentant. We delight in His ways!

Remember, proper study is needed and your eyes will be opened to see the truth.

In Blindness and In Rebellion

Remember this -

Someone brought this to my attention the other day -

I’ve already posted this in a comment -

This is demonic possession. It is time to stop fooling around and dancing around the things that have become so clear. It is bad enough to see grown men and women (of which I was one) do these things. We already know it has spread into the youth because of the long-standing and heretical Joel’s Army. But, oh, these are small children, still babies!

False doctrine breeds heresy.

Romans 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting.; 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness, full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness, they are whisperers, 30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving unforgiving, unmerciful; 32 who, knowing the righteousness judgement of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same, but also approve of those who practice them.

Matthew 18:4 “Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

:6 Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to sin, it would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck and he were drowned in the depth of the sea.

Have we lost a fear of God? I believe so. People who practice these things  no longer consider the truth in scripture. Even those who do not do these things, encourage those who do and make excuses for them, twisting the scriptures to say things they do not. They are just as blind as those who do, and in rebellion just the same.

This is madness.

Consider the second video in which these little children are laying hands on grown men who fall to the floor. In a previous conversation with another, I was given the following scriptures to support these goings on.

Please also take the time to read the surrounding scriptures to see the context. It is important to see the details.

Rev.1:17 And when I saw Him, I fell at His feet as dead. But He laid His right hand on me, saying to me, “Do not be afraid; I am the First and the Last.”

This is an account of John who was a disciple of Jesus, exiled for his faith to the island of Patmos. John is receiving a vision of things to come  – aka the book of The Revelation of Jesus Christ.

Ezekiel 1:28 Like the appearance of a rainbow in a cloud on a rainy day, so was the appearance of the brightness all around it. This was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the Lord. So when I saw it, I fell on my face and I heard a voice of One speaking.

Let’s look at the next section, Chapter 2:1 And He said to me, Son of man, stand on your feet, and I will speak to you.

Daniel 8:17,18 So he came near where I stood and when he came I was afraid and fell on my face; but he said to me; “Understand, son of man, that the vision refers to the time of the end.” 18 Now as he was speaking with me, I was in a deep sleep with my face to the ground; but he touched me, and stood upright.

All of these men were taken into supernatural experiences for God’s purposes.  When they fell, it was out of fear. What happened? They were told to not fear. They were made to stand upright. These were not just experiences of visions or visitations, but were important meetings to establish words of scripture!

They were not children.

They were not women.

They were not aided by another human.

They were not anointed with manufactured oil.

No one laid hands on them.

No one blew thier stinky breath on them.

No one waved their arms or jumped up and down in front of them.

They were not in meetings, conferences or gatherings.

They had not been in extended ecstatic worship.

No one taught them these things in classrooms or organized training.

What was the direction in which they fell? Forward – on their faces.

These events were initiated by God, not men.

Let me stress one more time – grown men, not children, not children, not children.

Now, if you cannot see the difference between the happenings in the videos and the scriptures here by my writing and the points I have made, and you believe you are born again, then I urge you to repent for your blindness and your rebellion to God. The differences are like night and day.

a retelling of the good news

aaahhh – is she posting? Is she actually writing something? Oh, she is!

I believe that God created man in His own image. Two of them to begin with, who were placed in a beautiful place to live, without hassles. God walked with them and spoke to them every day and enjoyed the company of His creation and called it good. Eventually these created beings made the wrong choice out of their God-given right to free will, the right to choose. They did not listen to God, their Father, but listened instead to a well-formed lie woven by a crafty manipulator. They called the lie the truth and found that it was good. They were banished from paradise and the hassles of life as we know it began.

After that God made many covenants and attempts to reconnect with His people throughout time. He gave them laws and blessings and waited patiently, with what He refers to as longsuffering, (we say this loooonnngsuuuuferrrrriiiiiinnnnngggg) for them to respond. But man’s heart, despite all the good given to him, is wicked. Man continue to fail and to live in sin by making bad choices through the act of  – again – God-given free will. I want to add here that man’s continued failure came as no surprise to God. This is an important point because the next thing  – the greatest thing – was not God’s plan B. God was not like Ford Motor Company who some decades ago needed to get a better idea. No, this plan, this one plan to end all plans had been there before even the foundation of the earth. He just had it tucked in His back pocket for the right time to come rolling around. Waiting is not a problem to God because to Him one thousand years is like a day. You and I can’t hardly wait for the next payday to come rolling around, much less the next thousand years!

Ok. So enter Jesus. Yes. Jesus. Yeshua. The Messiah, the one and only son of the Most High God. Jesus, although He is called the Son of God is really God Himself, God in the flesh and as we are told He is called Immanuel. And, wait because it gets better. Jesus, the son of the Most High God, the one sent to deliver God’s people was born of a virgin named Mary – just a little bit of a girl really, not a big bustling woman, not a well-known well dressed woman of the world that all the girls looked up to, just little bitty Mary who had never once had sex.

An angel, a real one not called Emma, visited Mary and told her that the Lord had found favor with her and that she was going to have a child and that the name would be Jesus. When she asked how that was to be, her having still been a virgin, the angel not called Emma told her that she would be visited by the Holy Spirit.  This is a true visitation because the same angel told Mary’s boyfriend Joseph the same thing. Then, nine months later she indeed gave birth to a baby boy, the one who would even deliver her. As a woman and a mother this astounds me. Some days we have thoughts or realizations that make us feel like we ran splat right into a wall. This is one of them and it happens every time I think that a young girl gave birth to the one who would deliver and save anyone who called on His name – the name above every name. Jesus is the one who came to bring people back into relationship with God. He came to fix that bad decision made by free will that banished man from paradise. The one that made us have kids with runny noses who wouldn’t do what we said despite our blessings and rules. The kids who insist on doing things their own way. The ones with free will. Ahem.

There’s another splat into the wall moment coming up. Jesus grew into a man and began to teach all who would listen about the Father and about the kingdom of God. He chose twelve men who liked to make bad decisions, but they listened and believed in Him. Because Jesus is God He could tell the condition of the hearts of those around Him. Many hated this because they wanted to continue to live out their lives of the lie, the one that began by the crafty manipulator so long ago. Oh no. Crafty never left the scene. He’s always been there. So in their blindness and their insistence on being right – their pride – and because of their kinship to Crafty, they hated Jesus and planned to get rid of Him. But many others loved Him and to those He gave forgiveness of sin and eternal life.

Jesus taught his disciples many things and spoke of His own death and the coming of the Holy Spirit who He also referred to as the Comforter. He told them that the Holy Spirit would convict the world of sin, which is the need to make those dumb free will choices, and that He would lead them into all truth. Then the dark and dreadful day came that Jesus was arrested and taken from them. He was brought to a court where His destiny had already been decided. They mocked Him even though He loved them they beat Him nearly unrecognizable. Then they put nails in His hands and feet and hung Him up that way to die on a cross.

This is what I do not understand.  People can read this story and those facts of the savage brutality, which was an act of wicked, wicked hearts, and they are not moved. Yet, those very same people will rise up against someone who mistreated a dog.

Only three people remained to watch Jesus die. Only three. One was His mother Mary. Then they took Him down, loving wrapped Him in cloths and laid Him alone in a tomb. Have you buried a child?

Those who hated Jesus thought it was the end. The crafty one thought he had won and that people would forever be under his rule. He often thought more of himself than he should and is how he ended on his belly.  See? They were all wrong. Jesus rose on the third day, defeating the death of the cross, winning the battle and proving to all that He is indeed God. Because no one has the power to overcome death but God himself. Kinda lets the umph out of those vampire stories, huh? Team Edward, Team Jacob sorry, you lose too.

So let’s look at this because for a long time I never got the Jesus gotta die thing. When the two were removed from paradise and were banished it was because of their sin in not doing what God said. Sin leads to death. Don’t debate it in your mind just accept it as fact because as  humans it will never make sense. It is necessary to give life to live, so then God came to earth to die in our place so that if we believe in Him we will not die but live forever. Yes, there is a physical death but then we live again with Him. It’s another wall moment because God who is capable of anything could have done any of it or all of it differently but chose not to. That is His love. Don’t miss that point because it is the greatest. And if you decide to do the free will thing here and miss it you will die in your sin and it will be too late to change your mind later on.

Jesus appeared to His disciples and again, taught them, ate with them, comforted them. The first person who saw him was not a man, but a woman. Ha. I love that. It’s one up for the girls. Jesus told His disciples He would be leaving them. He told them to go and wait in a room for the gift to come. As they spoke He went up into the heavens and they watched Him go. Again, there was a visit from an angel, this one wasn’t Emma either, who told them they would see Him come again in the same way they saw Him leave. Translated this means that Jesus will be in the heavens the next time we see Him! The Message says Jesus disappeared mysteriously. Don’t read the Message. It is a book authored by the crafty one, yes, he has books, and this one is a well hidden fact.

The disciples and followers of Jesus went to the room and waited. It was their turn for longsuffering. They were obedient to the instructions of their Lord and were given the gift of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. He came with might and power. He came with great authority and as Jesus said He would, He convicted the people of sin. Many were saved – 3,000 at time and the church of Jesus Christ grew in number and influence. They knew they had the free will choice to do stupid and purposeless things. They knew that they  could leave at any moment and return to their homes and to their jobs and wine vats. But they chose something different. They chose to hear the word and they received it well. Many of them gave their lives so that others could hear the news of Jesus Christ. And to this day it continues. That is the basic story of the gospel of Jesus Christ that is to be preached to all creatures to the ends of the earth.

And you thought Steven Spielberg could tell stories!

Jesus came to earth in a way that the people did not expect Him to. They were waiting for a ruler to restore their kingdom. Jesus told them His kingdom is not of this world. I have no doubt that the Holy Spirit came in a way that they did not expect either. Who could prepare for such power? Have you ever spoken the word of God to someone and you knew there’ s no  way those words could have come from you? That was the Holy Spirit. It’s a kapow deal. A step up from the wall moment. But make no mistake, the Holy Spirit is Jesus, He is God and in that He is distinct. Crafty has his own distinctions and men have once again traded the truth for the lie and called it good. Catch that.

This is a simplified version, my having had no forethought on this at all! – and that is the point. It is simple. But, its such a crazy story  – not my retelling but the real complete unabridged one found in the bible.  And still some days, even though I believe and know that it is true I wonder why… or how. It is bizarre to my human, selfish mind why God would go and do the things He went and did. But, I think that’s the point.

Who else would do such a thing but God Himself?

splat right into the wall.

___

True it has been quite some time since I have written anything. I write this today in honor of Jesus Christ who is everything the bible claims He is. Today is the 1st anniversary of Steven’s death, my husband’s beautiful son. I write this in honor of Christ who does give us life abundant. In Him there is peace, there is joy and the hope of things to come when we see Him in the clouds on a day when there will be no more tears or sorrow or death. Then day when God makes all things new. He holds all our tears in a bottle, ya know?

Feeling the Spirit?

The following article was written by Kent Philpott with Earthen Vessel Publishing. There has been so much focus around the importance of worship and so many false claims and misunderstandings related to worship and what can be accomplished through its practice. I am glad for this article as it pointed out things that I had questioned myself.

Feeling the Spirit?

palms blowing

by Kent Philpott

I was once a wild-eyed Pentecostal. Before that I was a rock ‘n roller, feeling the beat, the louder the better. Detractors–those non-spiritual Christians who surely did not even have the Spirit at all, warned that what the people experienced at the church I pastored was emotion-based and not the Holy Spirit. I would laugh at the sour grape nay sayers, the wannabes who would be dancing to the praise and worship band if only they had one. I felt sorry for them as I imagined their dead, cold services.

Somewhere, somehow I changed my mind. It may have been the day I woke up to the fact that I needed more and more music, swaying, waving of arms, and singing repetitiously the same chorus to get to that happy place where I could say, “The Holy Spirit has shown up.”

The church I now pastor has a few folks who have come from charismatic/Pentecostal churches. At times they have pressed me to get more excitement into the worship services. Despite my recounting my days as a Spirit-filled rocking pastor, I could see that my explanation was not working. They could not see anything wrong with feeling the Spirit–after all, didn’t God make our emotions, too? And this one really hurt: if I was really evangelistic as I claimed, it would not matter how we got the butts into the pew, just as long as we did.

And then, what was the harm of having some good feeling going on at church? Of course, I can get just as easily get worked up singing the Gloria Patri, even the old standard Doxology, but young people need more, the argument goes. The new generation is unlike any other, and they respond only to cutting edge techy media stuff.

There are going to be feelings and emotions, happiness and tears, and sometimes more than that in a worship service. These can not be avoided and neither should they be. But, and this is the point I want to make, to equate the Holy Spirit with feelings is dead wrong.

Looking at the early Church

Acts 2:42 provides a glimpse of the day by day practice of the early church. “And they devoted themselves to the apostles’ teaching and fellowship, to the breaking of bread and the prayers.” And this is presented in the same chapter as the Day of Pentecost events and Peter’s sermon. There is not a word about music, yet in that era there were musical instruments and choirs in abundance, since it was common practice in the Temple worship to have both. Let me be clear that I am not against choirs and music—we have both in the church I pastor; in fact, I play choruses each Sunday on my guitar and am accompanied by a bass guitar, piano, a mandolin, and a drum. But it fits into the worship service, during a short bit of time, and it is not done in such a way as to produce a sense that the Spirit has now arrived. None of it is designed to produce an emotionally charged environment that must occur as the “praise choruses” are sung on and on to a rock beat.

Of the five “pentecosts” in Acts–two in Jerusalem (Acts 2 and 4), one in Samaria (Acts 8), another in Caesarea (Acts 10), and yet another in Ephesus (Acts 19), there is not one mention of any form of music. No, the message of Jesus was proclaimed and the Holy Spirit came in power to save. In fact, nowhere in the book of Acts is there any mention of music, much less a praise band and swaying to any beat at all.

Paul mentions twice in his letters the singing of psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs (see Ephesians 5:19 and Colossians 3:16). For a Jewish man accustomed to Levitical worship his statements make perfect sense. This is a far cry from what goes on in the churches where the music dominates the worship and moves people into feeling, an emotion-centered activity that often morphs into what are thought to be charismatic gifts of the Spirit.

I spoke in tongues for years and introduced it to thousands of people in the 1970s. I have heard thousands speak in tongues in large meetings and in small prayer meetings. They were unintelligible, and no one thought they were hearing God being extolled as at the Pentecost of Acts 2. For many years I led people into prolonged singing of praise choruses until the singing in the spirit, the prophesying, and other more strange things, including wild dancing, began to take place. Always we thought it was soley due to the Spirit showing up. None of these things would occur during the preaching and teaching of the Bible and the Gospel,  events which were fairly mild and calm. The idea was generated that the Bible preaching and teaching was only a run-up to the real thing. This mistake led us to greater and greater error, until today we have the Bethel thing in Redding, California, the Kansas City prophets and International House of Prayer, along with Mike Bickel, Rick Joyner, Patricia King, and so on.

The appearance of evangelistic success

Filling up a place with people is not the same as God’s calling, justifying, and glorifying (see Romans 8:30). An influx of people into a church may or may not be the result of genuine conversions. During the Jesus People Movement, roughly 1967 to 1975, those who were being saved came as regular as clock work. But once that wonderful awakening was concluded by God’s sovereign hand, the conversions were slower, really few and far between. Not understanding how God works, we manufactured attraction, and it was primarily through music. To a degree, that worked, or appeared to work, but it was different. We had to get professional, practiced, and careful in the creation of a worshipful ambience—but it was planning and process. We became entertainers, we were meeting felt needs, and we created networks of people so that social bonding would take place. We developed small groups that were designed to connect people. More people came in and we called it evangelism.

There was, however, something else that took place, and even now I am shocked at the unbiblical nature of it: We assumed that everyone who would enter into the praise and worship with singing and speaking in the “Spirit” had to be born again, since we were convinced that it required the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in order to exercise such gifts. That became our evangelism. There was virtually no need to preach the message of the cross, all we needed was a good praise and worship team. Some of us at that time detected, to a degree, that something was wrong. Our efforts to move many of these people into Bible study groups was not successful. What people wanted was the music and the bliss of zoning out on it all.

Let me confess that it took me two decades to see my error. I wanted so badly to succeed and was always mindful of having a family that required an inflow of money. What was I to do but go along with the dominant model? Then about 1995 I began to change. This was most evident in the plain and simple Gospel messages I began to preach. While there were a few conversions, they did not make up for the numbers of people who went elsewhere. Many a time I considered going back to the old processes. With all I was reading and hearing, it seemed I was out of step, an old fogie, someone trapped in a time warp. In a way I cannot understand, and certainly my feelings had nothing to do with it, I was content with presenting the Word to those who would listen. In describing myself I began to say, “I am an old time Gospel preacher.”

An outrageous statement?

There is not one shred of truth to the idea that the Holy Spirit’s work is to make us feel good. To put it another way, having feelings in a worship service or some other venue is not the direct action of the Holy Spirit. The objective is to worship the God of our salvation; it is not to have an experience.

There is no supporting biblical evidence that the senses are to be gratified during worship.  Someone will say, what about joy? But joy is a state of mind, the sure knowledge that Jesus has rescued, forgiven, sealed, and indwelt the former dirty rotten sinner headed for hell. The Holy Spirit blesses us also, but there is no evidence that such a blessing is feeling-oriented. I am blessed whether I feel it or not.

My contention is that it is not the Holy Spirit who produces feelings. Feelings may be there, or not be there; in either case it has nothing to do with the Spirit of God.

Let me take it one step further. It is misrepresenting the Holy Spirit to equate His presence with feelings. Such may not fall into the category of blaspheming the Spirit, but it is error nevertheless.

Payback

Not that I think that there is anything like cosmic payback, but what I used to dish out to local pastors and churches—“we have the Spirit and you do not”—I am now receiving from young pastors of new church plants: Philpott? Well, all he does is teach the Bible. He needs the Spirit, but he doesn’t even have a band!

There is a catch phrase that goes something like this:
“Too much Word with too little Spirit, you dry up.
Too much Spirit with too little Word, you blow up.
With the right balance, we grow up.”

That may not be exactly it, but we used something similar during the 1970s to essentially say that we had the right balance and others did not. Too much Word meant that the Holy Spirit was being ignored. Not us, since we had praise and worship with spiritual gifting for at least a half hour at each service. Of course, we assumed that what we were doing was of God. There was no proof of it; there was nothing in Scripture that would validate what we experienced. We took it for granted we were safe, because we learned it from well known and recognized leaders in pentecostal circles. How could we be wrong?

“Right balance.” How would one know when a right balance was reached? Is there any biblical passage that would serve as a gauge? Upon further consideration this little piece of sophistry is nothing more than a boast—a sectarian, if not cultic, way of saying we have it and you don’t.

A possible response

Let me admit that as a pastor I am troubled by the emphasis on feeling the Spirit.  New churches continually show up in our county touting their music ministry and the power of the Spirit in their midst. For me it has the sense that there are wolves circling the sheep in the little flock under my oversight. In doing my job of protecting the flock I have lost a few battles.  To a generation raised on rock ‘n roll, the band sounds awfully good and the old hymns seem, humm, old and hard to understand with all the Bible doctrine intertwined therein.

What can I do? By His grace I hope to keep doing what I know is right to do and preach the Word and trust that the Spirit of God is with us, because we gather in the name of Jesus. Remember Jesus’ promise, “For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I among them” (Matthew 18:20).

Finally, it is clear that what the mature believer wants is the meat of the Word and the joyful truth of the Gospel of grace. Faithful pastors and churches must not yield to what looks now to be successful and popular. We have learned that the desire to feel the Spirit becomes insatiable, just like the need for more and more miracles, and thus we are led farther and farther from the clear practice of the early Church.

Beware the feel of the beat and the flesh.

How to Discern a True Work of the Spirit by Bob DeWaay

Audio link and teaching notes follow~

Recently I received a comment from Norcal with a link to a teaching by Bob DeWaay, “How to Discern a True Work of the Spirit”. I think this is perfect timing for those who are struggling with the truth behind these “revival and outpouring meetings” which are just revving up again.  From my own experience and that of others it can be hard to determine what exactly is going on in these meetings and videos.

When these well known and supported men and women come in the name of the Lord, making claims of healing, salvation, restoration, miracles, signs and wonders we often make the mistake these claims are true because they sound so good. And the truth is, they can be pretty close to the truth.

A quote from Charles Spurgeon -Discernment is not knowing the difference between right and wrong. It is knowing the difference between right and almost right .

This is why we need each other and why we are described as a body (Romans 12:3-8) Each of us has a function just as each of us has a part. Together, under the headship of Christ, through the the work of the Holy Spirit we support each other and contribute that which has been given to us. Then we are able to better discern, to help those who struggle and to better support the body!  Of course we all need to be grounded in the Word of God.  There is no excuse to not be!

Following are the thoughts from Norcal:

While studying and preparing to teach our small group “how to test the spirits”, I came across Bob DeWaay’s sermon titled, “How to Discern a True Work of the Spirit”.

It’s the simplest, bottom-line method I’ve heard for testing the spirits. In short, the premise is based on Jesus’ words in John 16:13-14, “However when He, the Spirit of Truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. 14) He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.”

The work of the Holy Spirit is to glorify Jesus…the birth, life, work, ministry, substitutionary death and resurrection of Jesus. In other words, the gospel.

All meaningless signs (laughing, shaking, gold dust, drunkenness, etc) that don’t glorify Jesus in the proclaiming of the gospel are proofs that their source is not the work of the Holy Spirit.

Here’s a link to the mp3 audio of the sermon:

http://www.twincityfellowship.com/audio/sermon_mp3/20071104_tcf_sermon.mp3

Here are the teaching notes–

How to Discern a True Work of the Spirit

Bob DeWaay   November 4, 2007   Twin City Fellowship

“The Spirit of Truth . . . He will bear witness of Me” (John 15:26)

How to discern spirits

1John 4:1, 2

Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God;

How to discern spirits

1John 4:3, 5

and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; and this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world. They are from the world; therefore they speak as from the world, and the world listens to them.

The Holy Spirit motivates believers to confess the truth about Christ

1Corinthians 12:3

Therefore I make known to you, that no one speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus is accursed”; and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.

Testimony about Jesus is the work of the Holy Spirit who inspires all prophecy

Revelation 19:10

And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said to me, “Do not do that; I am a fellow servant of yours and your brethren who hold the testimony of Jesus; worship God. For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.”

True prophets testified about Christ

1Peter 1:10, 11

As to this salvation, the prophets who prophesied of the grace that would come to you made careful search and inquiry, seeking to know what person or time the Spirit of Christ within them was indicating as He predicted the sufferings of Christ and the glories to follow.

The Holy Spirit inspired true prophets

2Peter 1:20,21

But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.

False prophets “deny the Master”

2Peter 2:1

But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.

They deny the master by “going to far” and not “abiding” in the teaching of Christ

2John 1:9

Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son.

The Holy Spirit Testifies of Christ

John 15:26

When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, He will bear witness of Me,

The Holy Spirit Testifies of Christ

Numbers 24:2, 17 (NKJV)

And Balaam raised his eyes, and saw Israel encamped according to their tribes; and the Spirit of God came upon him.  . . . . “I see Him, but not now; I behold Him, but not near; A Star shall come out of Jacob; A Scepter shall rise out of Israel, And batter the brow of Moab, And destroy all the sons of tumult.”

John the Baptist testified of Christ

Luke 3:16

John answered and said to them all, “As for me, I baptize you with water; but One is coming who is mightier than I, and I am not fit to untie the thong of His sandals; He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.”

Simeon Testified of Christ

Luke 2:25, 26

And behold, there was a man in Jerusalem whose name was Simeon; and this man was righteous and devout, looking for the consolation of Israel; and the Holy Spirit was upon him. And it had been revealed to him by the Holy Spirit that he would not see death before he had seen the Lord’s Christ.

Simeon Testified of Salvation

Luke 2:27 – 30

And he came in the Spirit into the temple; and when the parents brought in the child Jesus, to carry out for Him the custom of the Law, then he took Him into his arms, and blessed God, and said,  “Now Lord, Thou dost let Thy bond-servant depart In peace, according to Thy word; For my eyes have seen Thy salvation,

God testifies as the Holy Spirit descends on the Son

Luke 3:22

and the Holy Spirit descended upon Him in bodily form like a dove, and a voice came out of heaven, “Thou art My beloved Son, in Thee I am well-pleased.”

Jesus testifies about Himself

Luke 4:18

“The Spirit of the Lord is upon Me, Because He anointed Me to preach the gospel to the poor. He has sent Me to proclaim release to the captives, And recovery of sight to the blind, To set free those who are downtrodden,”

To blaspheme the Holy Spirit who anoints “Messiah” and who testifies of Him is to never be “released” from sin.

Luke 12:10

And everyone who will speak a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him; but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven [lit. “released”] him.

By the Spirit they will testify of Christ

Matthew 10:18 – 20

and you shall even be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. But when they deliver you up, do not become anxious about how or what you will speak; for it shall be given you in that hour what you are to speak. For it is not you who speak, but it is the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you.

Witnesses in the power of the Spirit

Luke 24:46 – 49

and He said to them, “Thus it is written, that the Christ should suffer and rise again from the dead the third day; and that repentance for forgiveness of sins should be proclaimed in His name to all the nations, beginning from Jerusalem. You are witnesses of these things. and behold, I am sending forth the promise of My Father upon you; but you are to stay in the city until you are clothed with power from on high.”

The Holy Spirit will empower them to testify of Christ

Acts 1:8

but you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and even to the remotest part of the earth.

Peter testifies of Christ

The Apostles witness to Christ

Acts 4:31, 33

And when they had prayed, the place where they had gathered together was shaken, and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and began to speak the word of God with boldness. . . And with great power the apostles were giving witness to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and abundant grace was upon them all.

Stephen testifies and is martyred

Acts 7:55, 56

But being full of the Holy Spirit, he [Stephen] gazed intently into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God; and he said, “Behold, I see the heavens opened up and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God.”

Paul is filled with the Holy Spirit

Acts 9:17

And Ananias departed and entered the house, and after laying his hands on him said, “Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus, who appeared to you on the road by which you were coming, has sent me so that you may regain your sight, and be filled with the Holy Spirit.”

Spirit filled Paul immediately proclaims Christ

Acts 9:20

and immediately he began to proclaim Jesus in the synagogues, saying, “He is the Son of God.”

Confession and Abiding

1John 4:13 – 15

By this we know that we abide in Him and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit. And we have beheld and bear witness that the Father has sent the Son to be the Savior of the world. Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God.

Knowing the true work of the Spirit

1John 4:2, 3

By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God; and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; and this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world.

Applications and Implications

1) Confessing Christ is not merely uttering words

2) Overcomers are born of God and believe the truth about Jesus Christ

1)      Confessing Christ is not merely uttering words

Matthew 7:22, 23

“Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness.’”

1)      Confessing Christ is not merely uttering words

Matthew 7:24

Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine, and acts upon them, may be compared to a wise man, who built his house upon the rock.

2)      Overcomers are born of God and believe the truth about Jesus Christ

1John 5:4, 5

For whatever is born of God overcomes the world; and this is the victory that has overcome the world– our faith. And who is the one who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?

2)      Overcomers are born of God and believe the truth about Jesus Christ

Revelation 3:5

“He who overcomes shall thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father, and before His angels.”

2) Overcomers are born of God and believe the truth about Jesus Christ

Matthew 10:32, 33

“Everyone therefore who shall confess Me before men, I will also confess him before My Father who is in heaven. But whoever shall deny Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father who is in heaven.”

______________________

Thanks Norcal! :)

Here again is the article I put together on the Holy Spirit after I came out of similar experiences -Holy Spirit Manifestations

Romans 15:5-6 Now may the God of patience and comfort grant you to be like-minded toward one another, according to Christ Jesus, that you may with one mind and one mouth glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

More Bad Water

Related previous articles

Another False Move Meeting

The Convergence of Bad Rivers

Spiritual drunkenness. Want to see what a drunk looks like?  Go to a bar and watch and then watch this video. It’s the same bodily movements and descriptions. Carol Arnott – the more she speaks the more she gets knocked by that spirit. It is not the Holy Spirit, but do you think those in the audience care?  And her husband John who says they’ve had more fun in the last 15 years than is probably legal. Really? Tell that to Christians in other countries who are tortured or martyred for their genuine faith.

Here are a couple of my articles that address these issues if you haven’t already read them:

Another Spirit

Spiritual Drunkenness

I’ve avoided the whole John Crowder/Benjamin Dunn scene because they are so disgusting they are beyond mention. If you want to watch them “toke the ghost” you can find them on youtube easily enough. I can’t get into it here as I find their videos to be nothing but an outright mockery of God.

I was on Truthspeakers Weblog a little while ago and found their women are teaming with Beni Johnson (Bethel) to do a women’s conference –  Girls Just Want To Have Fun (wasn’t that a Madonna song?  Oops nope. It’s Cyndi Lauper, but of course the most recent recording is Miley Cyrus! Who do you think these Crowder women are getting these messages from?)

Crowder says “its like girls gone wild in the glory”.  Is that supposed to be some kind of compliment?  Or maybe it’s telling of  just what kind of spirit is behind this movement. Then there’s the list of women throughout history who have impacted revival. hmmm.. Whose revival?

Still don’t think Bethel is going contemplative? Crowder is. Listen to the description of his upcoming conferences toward the end of the vid. Birds of a feather…

If you can bear it, watch the video. It links to their own youtube site.

Girls Gone Wild Just Want To Have Fun (links to vid)

Crowder at John Alexander Dowie’s grave (links to vid) and will give an idea of where he gets his “anointing”. (I’m having problems with this link but you can find it on his right sidebar if it doesn’t pop up.)

When I saw IHOP, Bethel and John Arnott (Toronto Blessing) team together I thought that was it. No. Bethel teaming with the Crowder/Dunn gang is beyond it. But, I fear it is still only the beginning. So, if its ok to be drunk in the spirit, now they will be wasted in the spirit. What an outrage before our God!  What vain imaginations!

They say that abortion is the ruination of America, God is judging. But, what about the outright mockery these people have made of Him? We may need to rethink exactly what it is God will judge us for. Lou Engle and all that hot air going out on abortion and his solemn assemblies…He’s right there in the mix.

These people claim faith in the Jesus Christ who died for their sins, the One who made it possible to connect them back into relationship with God the Father. Yet they deny Him with their words of false teaching and prophecy. They deny the true person of the Holy Spirit.  What is left for them now? Their Savior has already come. Who is left to save them?

Slain in Whose Spirit?

This is a very good video re: Slain in the Spirit that Redeemed Hippie has on her site.

If you or someone you know has experienced this manifestation attributed to the work of the Holy Spirit, you need to be aware of what the bible has to say, or in this case, does not have to say about it.

Watch the youtube video from ppsimmons

The Convergence of Bad Rivers

The Next Great Awakening, from CBN (watch video from link)

KANSAS CITY, Mo. – Thousands of people have been packing into special services at the International House of Prayer in Kansas City, Mo. They’re lured by the presence of God that has been falling upon the place over and over again since Nov. 11. Many have been healed, some physically, but plenty more emotionally and spiritually.

Now the question hanging over this visitation of the Holy Spirit: is this the start of something really big? Could this be the next Great Awakening? (Visitation of the Holy Spirit?)

Pastor Alan Koch from nearby Lee’s Summit, Mo., hopes so. He remembers what he heard at a global charismatic conference Kansas City hosted back in the 1970s.

“One of the prophecies that came out was that there were going to be spokes that were going to be going out to the nations, but the focus of that, the center was Kansas City,” he recalled.

When this move of God hit IHOP, the leaders immediately invited John and Carol Arnott of the 15-year-long Toronto Renewal and Bill and Benni Johnson of Redding, California’s miracle-packed Bethel Church to come check out what the Lord’s doing in Kansas City.  (See this:http://mkayla.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/another-false-move-meeting/)

At a jammed IHOP renewal service, Benni Johnson recalled a prophetic word given around 1909 by William Seymour, leader of the 1906 Azusa Street Revival: “He said ‘In another hundred years, there’s going to be another great outpouring. It’s going to be a Great Outpouring.”

“You do the math,” Johnson said. “We’re in that season now.”

Angelic Encounter

Johnson also shared a story told by a Welsh student at Bethel’s School of Supernatural Ministry. A woman from Wales described a wild encounter she had with an angel at the chapel where the great 1904 Welsh Revival began.

“She turned around and she saw a huge, huge angel. She said the foot of the angel was as large as the chapel. It was that big,” Johnson recalled. “And she actually had the nerve to talk to this angel, and said, ‘Are you the angel of this next Great Awakening?’ And he said, ‘No, I’m the angel of the 1904 Awakening. But there is another one coming. And it is bigger and it is greater.'”

Rivers of Revival Come Together

Carol Arnott shared the prophecy one of her most trusted Christian friends gave her about a year ago.

“Carol, the three rivers, Kansas City, Redding and Toronto, must come together. The three rivers must come together for what God wants to do in this next move,” Arnott remembered.

Johnson had something else prophetic to tell IHOP. “I woke up a year ago,” she said, “Woke up with this word: ‘Pray for IHOP, I’m about to do something.'”

“I felt that there was something strategic that was going to be happening,” Johnson explained. “This is perfect timing in God’s kingdom. And I’m so excited to see what God is doing here and in so many other places.”

As Johnson and Arnott shared, IHOP founder Mike Bickle said he had no knowledge of such prophecies when he invited the Arnotts and Johnsons to come support the Kansas City renewal as it began. A sense of awe filled the stage as the leaders of the three ministries realized God had already been weaving the three together prophetically long before they thought to come together in Kansas City.

Among The Young

IHOP is cheering such stories and prophecies. It also considers it a major sign that this awakening began in its Bible school among young people, and that it’s spreading rapidly to other college campuses via IHOP’s webcast. That’s because over the years many awakenings have begun at colleges and with the young.

“He is getting the heart of the next generation,” IHOP-U’s president Allen Hood said of the Lord. “When He wants to begin an awakening, He begins to get the heart of the college-age students.”

IHOP-U’s provost, Wes Hall said it’s significant God has been doing deep spiritual surgery among the young people, excising sins and hurts and brokenness.

“The Lord is setting them free from these heavy yokes so that they can be free to minister God’s love out of a real experience that His love is real, and His freedom is real. It’s not just a concept that the blood of Jesus makes you clean,” Hall explained.

His Goodness

Bethel’s Bill Johnson said it’s just a start for what God wants to show the world.

“There’s a realm and a measure of blessing that the Lord wants to release into the Earth that has never been seen before. Hosea chapter 3 says that in the latter days there will be a fear of God because of His goodness…because of His goodness,” he explained. (Pardon, but my bible does not use the word BECAUSE. In Hosea 3:8, it reads, Afterward the children of Israel shall return and seek the Lord their God and David their king. They shall fear the Lord and His goodness in the latter days.)

“There’s something about His goodness that’s going to strike us to the core, and bring a yieldedness that we’ve never been able to get any other way. He’s about to overwhelm and overtake,” Johnson said. (This is not the character of the Lord God to “overwhelm” or to “overtake”.)

Toronto’s John Arnott added a serious warning. One of the quickest ways to squelch revival is to be offended at the controversial signs and behavior that often accompany it.

He recalled how critics blasted Toronto’s renewal and the wild behaviors sometimes exhibited even as hundreds of thousands of people were getting saved and revived.

“It just baffled me,” Arnott said. “I’m looking around saying, ‘What’s not to like?’ So somebody fell down or somebody shouted. Come on! It’s so much deeper than that. It’s the life of God in the heart of His people setting them on fire with passion for Jesus.'”  (Arnott is indeed baffled, led astray from this devious, deceitful spirit he chases. Manifestations such as falling down, shaking, flailing limbs are not indicative of the presence of the Holy Spirit. So, yes, John Arnott, we are offended!)

Signs That Can Offend

Some IHOP staffers and students confess they were offended when they first saw some of their fellow IHOPers falling and laughing and shaking wildly under the influence of the Spirit.

Longtime Christian Crystal Camacho described her reaction the first day of the awakening.

“I am cynical, because people are rolling and laughing,” she said. “And I’m kind of like ‘Is this what revival looks like? If so, I’m offended.'”

But God brought the IHOP staffer and student up short the next day as she was praying for someone else to be freed from a judgmental, religious spirit.

“And I was like ‘God I pray that you set her free from religion,’ but I hear the Lord say, ‘Crystal, how can you pray for someone’s freedom and yet you are in the same bondage?,'” she asked.

Then Camacho surrendered herself to God, asked for prayer from others at the renewal and was soon knocked out in the Spirit. She came up shaking in the Lord for hours and it’s been happening frequently ever since.

“From 6 p.m. to 4 a.m. I could not stop shaking under the presence of the Lord, and I was filled with joy!” she exclaimed. “And it’s non-stop. Like even when I’m sleeping, I’ll wake up with just bursts of laughter.”  (Laughter or hysteria? I don’t understand the idea that we can be in Christ Who has made us free and yet be in bondage.  What a lie. Her original “offense” was her first clue something was truly wrong there!)

A Hub for Worldwide Revival?

This willingness to surrender to God, no matter the cost. seems to be a serious sign many at IHOP and involved in the renewal are ready to be used on a wider stage. And IHOP’s in an extremely strategic position to become a hub for worldwide revival.

The ministry has been sending prayer and worship up to God 24-hours a day for 10 solid years now, and it has more than 70 people in its media department to feed that worship across the Earth over TV and the Web.

That ability to broadcast made last year’s Lakeland revival the first one to go global almost immediately.

“When God pours out His Spirit today, we saw from Lakeland, that it’ll go around the world just like that,” Hood said, snapping his fingers. “What’s exciting about that is that with one outpouring, the global bride of Christ can get awakened and set on fire.”

______

It is true we are seeing something come together between IHOP, Bethel, Lakeland, stemming from the Toronto Blessing lies of the “latter rain” and their false prophets and false doctrines.  Pray that the truth of these movements be evident to all.

If you are involved in these movements and gatherings, what you experience is not the latest move of God, not His presence or His love. It is a false spirit. Forget about how good it feels and how much you giggle. Read your bible, specifically about the work of the Holy Spirit in the life of a believer,  and get away from this masquerading one.

True revivals are about repentance and the need for salvation! False revivals are all about the person, their destiny, falling down and feeling drunk! Big difference.

Holy Spirit articles here