Matthew 10:7-8 As you go, preach, saying “The kingdom of Heaven is at hand. 8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out demons. Freely you have received, freely give.”
This is the stuff I came out of – (false) HEALING –
Randy Clark was one of the speakers (along with Bill Johnson) at the one and only IAHR (International Assoc of Healing Rooms -Cal Pierce/John G. Lake) conference I attended a few years ago in Spokane. He also was very influential in the spiritual life of the Healing Rooms Director I worked with. I have a video of Randy and Todd at Lakeland on my blog doing that impartation thing –electrocution style. Impartation is a very big thing in charismania. I’m sure it’s were I picked up the demons. Bad stuff.
Watch it here to see if you really want to be a part of the teaching and impartation offered by Randy and his cohorts- and hear them discuss the connection between Todd Bentley, Randy Clark and the Toronto Blessing – Lakeland Electrocution Impartation
A man cannot impart spiritual gifts, power, anointing, knowledge or wisdom into another. Those things are given through God alone. The Holy Spirit IS God, so how can a man who teaches improper things and false doctrine impart Him to you? It cannot be done. Let me warn you. Watching and listening to false teaching in agreement is enough to invite demons into your life. If you open your mind to the thought that “maybe they are right, maybe they know more than I” you have opened a door for deception. The devil will be very happy to lead you further astray.This is what happened to me.
Link to Randy Clark’s ministry – Global Awakening (There’s that word again – AWAKENING) Does this sound like it has anything to do with Christ or the gospel?
Again, in these teachings and ministries they completely deny the work of the Holy Spirit in believing THEY are the carriers of His presence. THEY have the answer to why people don’t heal when they are prayed for. Forget the sovereignty of God. Word of Faith has the answer everyone is looking for. They spin off of Ken Hagin’s stuff. It’s witchcraft repackaged!
It is God who heals. We pray, He moves. Not everyone gets healed and we do not know why. It is not our place to know. It is not even our place to ask or to question God. I don’t care how many times they spit out the word intimacy, there are some things we are not to know. Isaiah 55:8 For My thoughts are not your thoughts, nor are your ways My ways, says the Lord. 9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, So are My ways higher than your ways and My thoughts than your thoughts. Those who do not walk in the Spirit led lifestyle will go after other knowledge and claim to know things the rest of us do not. Whatever they are selling, even if they offer it for free – you do not want it.
Acts 8:18-24 Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. 18 and when Simon saw that through the laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Spirit was given, he offered them money, 19 saying, “Give me this power also, that anyone on whom I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit.” 20 But Peter said to him, “Your money perish with you, because you thought that the gift of God could be purchased with money! 21 You have neither part nor portion in this matter, for your heart is not right in the sight of God. 22 Repent therefore of this your wickedness, and pray God if perhaps the thought of your heart may be forgiven you. 23 For I see that you are poisoned by bitterness and bound by iniquity.” 24 Then Simon answered and said, “Pray to the Lord for me, that none of the things which you have spoken may come upon me.”
Simon was a new believer as noted in verse 13, having had been a sorcerer. Being so new to the faith it is easy to be mistaken. Peter pointed his sin out to him in without haste and Simon repented. These gnostic laden teachers are not new believers and are therefore without excuse.
After all, where we we when God hung the stars into place and set the planets into orbit? Can we tell God how that is done? No. We cannot. (Those who think otherwise should read the last few chapters of Job.) Where we we when God formed Adam out of the dust of the ground creating intricate parts of the body that miraculously work together? We cannot tell Him how creation of man is done. We cannot tell Him how to heal a person. And we cannot tell another how to heal a person. Healing comes only from the power of God Himself through His choice to heal or to not heal. It will never come through a man made method or decree or proclamation, nor by study course or impartation!
It certainly does not come from healing energy, (see their message below) which sounds very much like Reiki, a Japanese technique for reducing stress and promoting healing through the laying on of hands. The word Reiki is made of two Japanese words – Rei which means “God’s Wisdom or the Higher Power” and Ki which is “life force energy”. So Reiki is actually “spiritually guided life force energy.“Read more here – What is Reiki
Be careful, be wise and ask the Lord to give us all greater discernment in these times.
Revival Phenomena and Healing
The Agony of Defeat, The Thrill of Victory, Four Kinds of Faith for Healing, Biblical Basis for Healing and Pressing In
Deliverance and Disbelief
Healing and the Kingdom, Deliverance: A Ten-Step Ministry Model, Throne Life, Healing out of Intimacy with God and Warfield: His counterfeit miracles and today’s echos.
Spiritual and Medical Perspectives
History of Healing within Christianity and Healing Energy
Pingback: False Healing Impartation « Truthspeaker’s Weblog
Todd Bentley was probably accepted by many Christians because he operated Toronto “Blessing” type spiritual phenomena (eg. shaking, quaking, and “slain”) that achieved widespread acceptance in various churches many years prior.
These phenomena are sensational and often pleasurable, many people are attracted to them, so many Christians may assume that is good to get more people coming in the church door, as it might be “revival” (lots of people getting excited about God).
However it is actually a diabolical intrusion to ruin churches.
It is an interesting co-incidence that TB is the initials for Todd Bentley and Toronto “Blessing”.
This article gives an overview of the origins of Toronto “Blessing” via Rodney Howard-Browne in 1994.
He challenged God: “touch me, or I will come up there and touch you”.
That is so improper and lacking in “Fear of the Lord”.
The Devil will be a best chum to anyone who speaks to God like that.
Improperly approaching God will attract familiar spirits to lead the foolish away on a magic carpet ride to somewhere.
This could explain the response Howard-Browne got: “a sensation as if his body was on fire and he broke out in uncontrollable laughter”.
The laughing could be a method to mask demonic infiltration, as laughter seems harmless, even beneficial.
The spiritual infestation subsequently spread world wide, and was infused into Nicky Gumbel’s “Alpha Course”.
You are right in these points. And I do agree that most people truly think they are following God. They just need to open their bibles and search for the truth. It is so sad that most people are afraid to even consider they may be off.
The first time I read about Kundalini (over a year ago) I couldn’t believe it could be possible. I still don’t know how exactly I fell into that, but I did. The day I heard Todd Bentley’s comment that he could feel the anointing in his back, my head spun around, because I remembered oddly feeling that same thing just recently and didn’t know why. Thankfully the power of God is mightier than the power of Kundalini and once I repented and came against these spirits – impartations, etc. I was free.
Thanks for the links and the information you provided. They are well worth the time for all to read!
I believe Jesus lives in us. That is what the bible says. Jesus also said that we would do even greater things than Jesus did on earth. Now God is doing it, He is the power. But if we seek God and Love God He will show His power in many ways. If you asked most any of these people that you blasted above I am sure they would not say that they were doing anything but God does it all. That is why there is no limit to what God can do through us. If we dont listen to God and act then nothing is going to happen for sure. Now not everything that happens in church is from God. Many people try to help God. So they do some things that God has nothing to do with. We as Christians have been brought up to pretty much doubt everything. We judge everything. I think we should learn to love on God. Spend time with Him at every chance. Like when we fall in love with someone. We want to spend every waking moment with that person. When we truly love God we want to spend every moment with Him. The more we love God the more we hear from God and the more we can do His will. I believe part of loving God is obeying Him. He said to go out an make converts, heal the sick, cast out demons and raise the dead. I believe the best way to make converts is to introduce them to Jesus. Many ways to do this but one way is to pray with people and listen to what God tells you. He will show up and do all the work and people will feel the love of God for them. If you introduce them to the love of God they wont be able to resist. We need to risk being wrong risk looking foolish and the only way we are going to do this is if we love God and love people.
What if 10% of the stuff that happens at healing conference is from God and the rest is not. Should we throw out the 10% so that we avoid the 90%. I dont believe so. I have grown up in church baptist, assembly of God and many others. If you dont step out in faith and let God use you then even if God shows up you want notice or you will think it is the devil. People are flawed and there is sin on the earth but God is still perfect and He chooses us. As soon as we are perfect then we will have a perfect church but I dont think that is going to happen until Jesus comes back.
Darrel, there is a big difference between God and the things that are discussed here, which are false. Many things can appear to be right. There is always a bit of truth mixed in with the lie, if not, then no one would follow. You are reciting phrases that I also heard, cleverly formed words that make us doubt ourselves. If there is 10% wrong and 90% true, or the other way around it is still 100% wrong in God’s eyes. He does not provide us with a mixture. These people come in the name of the Lord yet they do not follow Him. Christ warned of this very thing. The way we know they are not of Christ is because they are actually teaching things of the occult and other religions. Wake up and pay attention!
I couldn’t agree with you more.
M’Kayla you are correct in saying if just a small % of a lie mixed with truth makes it a lie. However, we are not talking about lies & truths.
We are talking about children growing, trusting, learning and falling.
A better analogy would be this:
I tell my child to go help someone and not to worry, I’ll have the gift ready when the time is ready, just show up and tell them they are loved.
If satan comes disguised as me and gives a false gift that looks identical and my child believes it, then I will as a loving father still love, understand, correct and teach discernment. I do not disown and tell my other children “cast your brother out, he was deceived”.
Now if my child realizes he was deceived and then “accepts” a new doctrine of devils and rejects me. that is an entirely different thing. One in which Darrel as well as myself do not believe is the same as some of the preachers, teachers being referred to here.
I hope that makes sense,
Rick what do you mean we aren’t talking about truth and lies? Of course we are. We or I, being my blog, am warning people of those who come in the name of Christ and yet teach other doctrines. What are you talking about?
I just did. re-read my text. I thought I explained it quite clearly with an analogy.
Let me explain it this way. I don’t believe some of the people you mention have conjured up a new doctrine and are plotting to deceive many. I believe they Love the Lord and some people who listen, watch, follow get hi-jacked by the enemy. Who’s fault is that? Who knows?
But thus far I have not heard anything signifcant taught by say “Bill Johnson” that is anti-biblical.
I say significant, because I could disagree or find something to debate about with nearly every preacher. But the main biblical truths that set the course for our major heading I find solid.
Sure when anything “supernatural” actually manifests it attracts all kinds of people, thoughts and Ideas. But from what I have seen Bill is always pointing to Jesus and allowing room for some to grow, fall and make mistakes. Just as Jesus did.
In fact we see Jesus’s diciples come back and say “we couldn’t cast those demons out like we could when we were with You?” Many could have have thought they looked like idiots trying to talk to invisible beings inside of people.
Rick if you haven’t seen anything anti-biblical by Bill Johnson, then clearly you aren’t looking. Everything he teaches just past the basic gospel is garbage, new age occult. This is why I blog against it. Or do you really believe that Christ gave up his divinity while he was on earth? This is a main point Johnson makes and as bad as it is, still is only a tip of the iceberg.
Well M’Kayla, I suppose that perhaps I’m either ignorant to all of Bill’s Teachings or at least ignorant to the ones that are Anti-Biblical.
I’ll have to look closer. I’ve watched at least a half a dozen of his sermons online and didn’t see anything stand out.
In regards to your statement of him believing Jesus gave up his divinity while he was on earth… I don’t even know what that mean. 🙂
And being fully God and fully Man as the Bible teaches I can see people having difficulty with that. I’m not sure why it’s a show stopper for you.
Jesus is God, always has been since the foundation of the earth the Bible says.
I don’t see Bill disagreeing with that. But hey, I’m not his lawyer.
I just listen to his sermons and thus far they have blessed me with truth.
I see fruit from his ministry. (I may also see nuts, but nuts followed Jesus also and people didn’t judge His ministry because of them even those that were Godless)
So like I said, perhaps there is something very significant I am missing.
I’ll read through your blog to see what you’ve found that stirs you up inside.
Meanwhile, I’ll keep praying to discern truth, and for those others that are trying to seek it.
Rick, another good source of information would be his books. This is where the truth of what he believes comes to light. Johnson does not teach that Jesus is fully God and fully man, he teaches that Jesus gave up his divinity. He goes on to add that Jesus is an example of what a man fully devoted to God can accomplish. In essence, he is lowering Christ to that of man and elevating man to the equivalent of God. Johnson is a word of faith teacher – the belief that we have the same power and authority as Jesus, we can call things into existence by decrees and proclamations. I am not en expert on Bill Johnson. I am familiar with him because of some of the teachings of his I used to listen to. I am out of International Association of Healing Rooms which he is a part of. I used to move in the false prophetic and was a trained SOZO minister. The list of false teachings and teachers who agree and have aligned with Bethel is enormous. There has been a coming together and it isn’t for the good of Christianity.
Hi There! I agree with Rick and Darrell and God’s Word. 🙂 M’Kayla, I am wondering if you might have mis-understood that Scripture verse you used about Simon?
~~~Didn’t you see and comprehend that Peter and John DID impart — via the laying on of Hands, they had the anointing for imparting Holy Spirit – 🙂 that can only come from God. Simmon,yes, was newly baptized by water, after he heard the Gospel of the Kingdom – and believed it. But he had not yet “renewed his mind” still had bad habits and was use to making money thru devils manipulations. etc etc.
**With kindness, I must say: head knowledge and revelation knowledge from The Holy Spirit differ. The Bible teaches us that. Walking in the spirit and walking in the carnal flesh is real different and war against each other.
The Bible is spiritually discerned – The Holy Spirit is the one who leads us into ALL TRUTH. Supernatural way of Life in Christ is all through the Bible – Front to Back. for every lie, there is the fact there is a Truth to be twisted – reversed or there would be nothing to lie about. 🙂 It is vital for believers to spend more time loving God Almighty than slandering ministers – which God is the Only judge of – and one might find themselves in danger of grieving the Holy Spirit or fighting against God. Spending time in God’s presence and His Word, asking The Holy Spirit to reveal what He wants to reveal to us is important and pleases God.
**Also, might be good to add some verses before #8 – might help with some detail…..:-)
15:(Peter/John) who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Spirit:
16: for as yet it was fallen upon none of them: only they had been baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus.
(((((See Simmon,along with others, had been baptized in water, but not the Spirit)))))) and they had a lot of learning to do. lol))))))))))
17: Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.
Acts 8: 18-20
18 and when Simon saw that through the laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Spirit was given, he offered them money, 19 saying, “Give me this power also, that anyone on whom I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit.” 20 But Peter said to him, “Your money perish with you,…………………
NOTE: Also, good to look at many bible versions and strong concordance, etc to get a pretty good understanding of scriptures. 🙂 fun fun love the WORD of GOD!!!!
Susieq, no I didn’t misunderstand. This post is in reference to those who lay hands on with intentions to impart what they have received out of false teachings, resulting in false gifts which are displays of the enemy, not of God. This is a mockery to the Lord God who gives gifts as He wills, not as man does. I would be careful with that claim to being so supernatural because that is the basis of lies from satan, those things being gnostic – peering into and wanting to see things we should not. The truth and the lie are so easily mistaken. God will not go outside His word, yet these teachings certainly do!
here is the only clip you need that shows that Bill Johnson is a false teacher. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzAwFYKe3h0
He is preaching a differrent gospel!!! Ironic that he preaches on the passage that exposes himself as a false teacher, but he uses TWISTED SCRIPTURE…Yeah, that is a BRAZEN false teacher.
I thank the Lord for your site, Mkayla your right these people are Gnostic’s
Here is a paragraph about these wolves, (Gnostic’s) I don’t remember the author, but this helped me realize the elitism in so much of the church today. It put words and structure to what I was feeling in the Spirit, a witness of what the Lord was saying. Perhaps this will help someone else.
“First John was written to counter a specific distortion of Christianity called Gnosticism, Gnosticism is a Greek term which relates to a special kind of elite knowledge. A Gnostic is a “knowing one” (Gnosis means to know, an agnostic is one who claims not to know.)
What was it that these Gnostics knew? Their knowledge was supposedly the knowledge of God! They had set themselves up as the ones who “know God in a way far superior to the ‘average Christian’’’. The Gnostics were impatient with the standard Christian teaching regarding the knowledge of God. It was just too simple and pedestrian. Good enough for uneducated peasants, slaves, and the disenfranchised people who made up the bulk of the Christian converts in the first century but orthodox Christianity was far too plain for converted philosophers and intellectuals!”
Hope this will bear witness to someone.
That is very interesting. I will have to take a much closer look at that. I can certainly relate to Gnostics and the group who believe they have superior knowledge over the rest. That’s the lie behind all of the deception these days.
Thanks for your contribution and your encouragement.
the site says “Receive a fresh impartation that will release a new dimension of revelation, along with a deep sense of confidence and resolve to pursue the deeper things of God!”
You can get revelation, confidence and resolve, all for only $59!
Ugh. The Simon anointing impartation.
What happened to
I can do all things thru Christ who strengthens me Philippians 4:13
Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think of anything as being from ourselves, but our sufficiency is from God 2 Corinthians 3:5
>> You can get revelation, confidence and resolve, all for only $59!
…. $59 for false counsel to send you towards the lake of fire.
If God has given instruction and counsel in a book (Bible), then it is no good ignoring the book and insisting God must give those instructions another way such as dreams/visions, angels, etc.
In that disobedience familiar spirits can turn up to deceive, or worse, God may hand you over to delusions (2Thess 2:11) for not loving the truth (reading and following Bible instruction).
Jesus said “a wicked and adulterous generation asks for a miraculous sign” (Matt 12:39).
Does “asking for a miraculous sign” command a performance from God just like the pursuit of supernatural experiences such as being “slain in the spirit”, “Toronto Blessing”, heavenly visitations and visions, etc.?
The Bible does not endorse people directing the Holy Spirit or teach methods to repeatedly make supernatural experiences or events occur in a style of presumption ahead of God’s sovereignty.
The desire to have experiences could be a self indulgent avoidance of what God really wants us to do.
When this disobedience and lack of discernment are combined, people may easily accept counterfeit phenomena from the Devil:
Matthew 24:24 For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect–if that were possible.
Could Christian fellowships become dens of the occult with things like body vibrations, howlings, apparitions, and visions given by demons?
Yes, some already are.
The seeking of experiences could be an attempt to treat the Holy Spirit like a circus clown or temple prostitute for personal indulgence.
All these wrong things may be tolerated because there is no Fear of the Lord and poor discernment:
Prov 1:29-31 Since they hated knowledge and did not choose to fear the LORD, since they would not accept my advice and spurned my rebuke, they will eat the fruit of their ways and be filled with the fruit of their schemes.
Christians should discern and reject fraudulent church teachers and ministers:
2 Cor 11:13-15 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.
If God has given instruction and counsel in the Bible, then read the Bible.
Be careful about seeking spirits (Holy Spirit or angels) for advice.
If a spirit does give you advice, then make sure it is compatible with Bible instruction and counsel.
1 John 4:1 Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
The Holy Spirit will never counsel in contradiction to the Bible.
Amen seeker3 good exhortation.
Hey M_K great post…,…I have been offline a few days
I noticed that. 🙂
“Matthew 10:7-8 As you go, preach, saying “The kingdom of Heaven is at hand. 8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out demons. Freely you have received, freely give.”
This is the stuff I came out of – HEALING – ”
I hope you haven’t ‘come out of’ praying for the sick to be healed, sister.
Hehehe. NO. I meant I came out of false healing movement (for lack of a better expression!) I still pray for the sick!! Sorry. I should have been more clear.
Right on the mark with that post.
Sadly, any averagely intelligent 10 year old unbelieving child could easily have the correct discernment about improper spiritual drunkenness ministries (Toronto “Blessing”, Todd Bentley & Lakeland, etc.), with the most basic logic:
“Dad, those church people looked like they were nuts.
They were vibrating, twitching, having slurred speech, nonsense speech and strange sounds.
Some were acting like dogs, chickens, and lions.
There were people staggering about like drunk, and lots fell over.
They were thrashing about, they looked like they were about to die.
And there was strange laughing going on.
It didn’t look funny, it looked scary.
Mr. Bentley kicked an old lady in the head.
I saw him holding someone else’s hand, not Mrs Bentley.
Are they on drugs or drunk?”
“Son, stay away from them, they must be into something devilish”.
That is the correct discernment about Todd Bentley, and similar madhouse church practitioners.
When people manifesting like Todd Bentley and John Crowder are accepted in churches, it is proof there is no discernment at all.
Some church people have been chasing novelty.
They want “dinner and a show” from “the spiritual powers”.
The Devil is obliging by turning some churches into Hellish niteclubs with demonic acts.
The Bible does not encourage Christians to seek “dinner and a show”.
That is just a disguised seeking of hedonistic self indulgence, similar to the worldly wallowing in sex, drugs, and rock and roll.
Wining and dining on entertainments from the Devil.
The Bible does not assert the Holy Spirit being at our disposal to give “bliss sessions” and other flesh indulgences similar to drunken euphoria and sex lust.
Titus 2:11-13 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age, looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ.
God wants us to have a right heart and sober mind that pursues truth, not a wallowing in experiences and abandonment of self control.
Psalm 86:11 Teach me your way, O LORD, and I will walk in your truth; give me an undivided heart, that I may fear your name.
1 Peter 1:13-17 Therefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and rest your hope fully upon the grace that is to be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ; as obedient children, not conforming yourselves to the former lusts, as in your ignorance; but as He who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct, because it is written, “Be holy, for I am holy.” And if you call on the Father, who without partiality judges according to each one’s work, conduct yourselves throughout the time of your stay here in fear.
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Thank you for this post. I find it interesting that there is so much emphasis on what, how, and where, and they don’t really mention WHO. I’ve recently reread C.S. Lewis’s great work The Screwtape Letters and it was amazingly on-spot. As long as they keep focus on the method, the devil can sit back, relax, and watch the saints move further from God and closer to idolatry.
Hi Susu. Very good point.
Thanks for sharing your experience. There is so much deception going on that those who aren’t in the Word on a daily basis are very much in danger of falling into it for a lack of love of the truth. Whenever people mention Healing Rooms I get very leary. Sometimes I think I’m being too critical, but this movement is so pervasive and people are so hungry to see the “power of God”. I have a couple of friends who have gone to one and claim people have experienced all kinds of deliverance. I’m just not sure about that.
Rachel, from past experience is it a false deliverance. The effects from this kind of prayer, aside from the fact that it is not biblical prayer, is that it brings a sense of well being, much like an effect from some drugs or alcohol. In time it will wear off, or the condition that led them to seek out the healing room will worsen. Or they may go through the rest of their lives under the delusion of the deliverance. It is hard to say what the future will bring. I had many experiences too, some very convincing, and powerful, life changing. But I had to come to the conclusion that they were not brought on through the presence of God, but another. You have a reason to doubt these claims. People are desperate to see God “do”, but sadly it is out of their own expectations of what they think He should do, out of their own self devised wills. It is a far step from the sovereign will of God.
Welcome to my blog.
Thank you for all your encouragement and kind words. I am so glad to see the information is helpful to you. I will be contacting your friend as you asked. I removed her name and e-mail for privacy reasons. Keep praying for her!
Hi M’kayla. Thanks for the thought provoking information. I just read an email from a friend who said they went to one of Randy Clark’s event, and from their perspective it was a positive experience. However, I personally not totally bought into all that. Yet at the same time, I am reading your words and find that you quote 2 passages of scripture. I am after truth – not what you or anyone else says, and I suspect that you also are after truth. So, I can’t help but bring out these points: in the first passage you quoted, Jesus is commanding His followers to go and heal, cleanse, raise and cast out. Jesus didn’t do it alone, He commanded (and empowered) His people to do it. Then, in the second passage, the People of God were laying their hands on other new believers to receive the Holy Spirit. This too is a clear example of God imparting the Spirit into the lives of some through the life of others – again, God didn’t do it alone, He was doing it “through” believers. So, that’s where I’m challenged right now – I’m reading what you wrote and you’re saying “A man cannot impart spiritual gifts, power, anointing, knowledge or wisdom into another. Those things are given through God alone.” Yet, the first passage you use shows Jesus commanding man to go heal, cleanse, raise, cast out; the second passage shows man laying hands on others and through man the Holy Spirit is imparted to them (they received the Spirit through the men laying hands on them). Both of these passages at the very least contradict what you are saying. In addiction, I recently came across some verses in Paul’s letters to Timothy which also suggest it is through man that Timothy received gifts: 2 Timothy 1:6 “For this reason I remind you to kindle afresh the gift of God which is in you through the laying on of my hands.” Also, 1 Timothy 4:14 “Do not neglect the spiritual gift within you, which was bestowed on you through prophetic utterance with the laying on of hands by the presbytery.”
All these verses seem to be very clear to me as I read them, though I may be less educated and less knowledgeable than yourself. Please help me to understand them in light of what you are saying here, lest your teaching be false as you are claiming of others. Again, I am not on this side or that side and I am open to know the Truth – that is what I am after.
This is a very good point you raised. And yes, I too am after the truth. In the NT we read these verses, the laying on of hands, healing, etc. in knowledge that these men who were imparted with the truth, and who laid hands on others to receive were men of God. There were no false doctrines being taught between them. Randy Clark, and others who are like minded manipulate scriptures to say or mean something other than is written. This is why there is such an emphasis on healing or imparting – and they are passing on another spirit that is not the Holy Spirit. The reason why we can be assured their spirit is not of God is because they are proven false teachers. The Holy Spirit will not reside with one who teaches the word falsely.
We do not NEED another person to pass or impart anything to us. We are believers and have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. So what I mean by this is that we don’t need to go running to a conference or meeting to receive anything from the Lord that He would freely give us. These men and women act as tho, and really do believe they have something the rest of us lack. And this is why very often they make it an urgency of the moment to run and get this thing they have to give. This is very dangerous! And like the word says, not to lay hands on to hastily, or to share in another’s sins, there is a reason for that. Elders laid hands on the sick to heal them, but again, they were elders, proven men of God. I am not against the laying on of hands, but I do believe the word is specific on how it is to be done and by who and when. Randy Clark and others who claim the power or authority to impart are not in that group. The apostles/disciples knew each other – they were intimate in their lives and saw how the other lived behind the scenes. Can we say that about Randy Clark or the others? No. We simply hear then say things about God that sound good, they use His name and we fall all over each other lining up to receive whatever it is that they have. This is a very bad practice the church has accepted.
The answer is in the word of God and their teachings to do not line up with scriptures. And if you allow them to lay hands on you and “impart”, even if the impartation is done corporate, and no one actually touches you, what you will receive is a spirit other than what you had hoped for – a demon. It is a powerful and felt presence that I believe is the same as kundalini, reiki and chi, one found in other religions and therapeutic practices.
I know this because I was one of them until the Lord showed me the truth. And I was at a conf where Randy Clark was one of the speakers so I am familiar with his methods which are like all the rest going back to the Kansas City Prophets in the 90’s, and for some, before that.
1 Timothy 4:14 Do not neglect the gift that is in you, which was given to you by prophecy with the laying on of the hands of the eldership.
2 Corinthians 11:4 For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted—you may well put up with it!
1 Timothy 5:22 Do not lay hands on anyone hastily, nor share in other people’s sins; keep yourself pure.
I hope that helps you understand a little more clearly, if not please let me know. There is quite a bit of info and conversation on my blog that will help to give you more insight into these things. Thank you for bringing this to my attention. 🙂
Honestly, I think it is unwise to cast judgment on someone.
I believe GOD can heal through the name of Jesus the Messiah.
Read the Bible, it is very clear that we can do the same (and greater works) as Jesus.
“Grace, Grace to it!”
israel, these people do not heal in the name of Jesus. They are false teachers, false leaders, false prophets. We are told in the bible to judge these things and since they do not teach the word for it’s truth, they do not have the power of God to heal. God does not operate through them. Christ did not come to bring physical healing, but spiritual, being the ultimate sacrifice for our sin. Greater things did not refer to healings, but to those who would come to Christ because of the testimony and work of the spreading of the gospel done by those men! We see this in the book of Acts!
It is unwise to follow a man simply because he claims to have the power and gifts of God, yet does not teach the word of God for what it says. This is the foundation of the Kansas City Prophets/Toronto/Lakeland/Bethel and in other groups and gatherings throughout the world. They are popular and gain much attention but are not of God. Be careful in who you trust and follow.
I am very heartened to find your blog. I have been greatly alarmed since discovering this charlatan false “prophet” Randy Clark. I was in a conference which featured him last year and he totally manipulated the crowd. Just for those like Israel, please listen to Mkayla, she’s telling the truth. There were people in wheelchairs in the conference, but the prophet ignored them and instead got the people with any kind of metal implants like pins and such to stand up and talked them into raising their hands to signal they had been healed. He then counted them up and called it “more than a hundred healed that night”.
I then recalled how he started the meeting pumping the crowd with how many had been healed in his previous meeting. I’m sure he went to the next after us and told them how there had been more than a hundred healed in our service. And though there were those there who obviously needed the real thing, they never got it from him!
I sincerely that in the last days, God will do great signs and miracles again through his people. But those that have no discernment and follow these false teachers who glorify themselves more than anyone else will miss the true miracles which God will bestow on His humble and holy people who have separated themselves from the corruption of the prosperous American culture
It is much like Mormonism. They talk to you and then tell you to pray after they leave and if you get a “warm feeling” that is God signifying to you that Mormonism is true. They get thousands of converts like that every year.
Randy Clark plays on several things, one of which is the desire for the honor of men. People want the honor of being looked at as having the Lord’s special favor, and healing in their touch. So Randy says “When you feel something, or start crying or shaking, that’s my anointing coming into you (that means you are becoming special like him). So those that desire it a little too much start feeling it. And of course, when they start shaking that means “look at me, I got it like Randy”.
Thank you for taking the time and effort to help others see the truth behind Randy Clark. He is quite instrumental in the false healing/false prophetic circles and spends a good amount of time or used to performing the annual IAHR conference in Spokane with Bill Johnson. The sad part is that he seems so sincere in what he does and maybe he believes it to be the truth. Many are deceived.
Ha. I didn’t know that about the Mormons. We got that warm feeling in the healing rooms quite often.
Take care. 🙂
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>> James Jones January 1, 2010 at 6:04 am: “…these people are Gnostic’s. Here is a paragraph about these wolves, (Gnostic’s) I don’t remember the author, but this helped me realize the elitism…
That paragraph James quoted comes from pages 9 & 10 of “Mending the Nets” by Bill Randles and can be viewed here http://www.theothersideoftheriver.com/Books/MendingNets.pdf
Christians are often intimidated with elitism of supposed “superior” knowledge and supposed “superior” experiences that go beyond what scripture teaches for Christian living.
They should take comfort from God through his Bible counsel to stay within “the simplicity that is in Christ”:
People are putting up with it!
They should be rejecting it, because going beyond “the simplicity that is in Christ” is associated with deception from Satan, similar to what happened with Eve.
There is a way that seems right – Prov 16:25
I recently attended a Randy Clarke conference (well just an evening of the conference) and I was actually quite surprised as to how often and genuinely he kept referring to the healing only being brought by the name of Jesus, how he couldn’t do anything himself except for pray and ask God himself to heal.
Of many healing ministries meetings I’ve been to, his was or of the few that wasn’t hysterical or hyped, generic or systematic. He just prayed and brought words of knowledge and constantly, constantly gave the glory to Jesus and explained biblically everything he was doing.
I guess I’m not “following” Randy, but taking don that weekend and seeking God for His leading and anointing for this gift. If anything I’ve been left with a hunger to continue to preach the gospel with opportunities like healing as Jesus did with the people of His day. At the end of it all, there are many many lost and wandering souls who might tempt turn their heads to a preacher or a church service but a miraculous healing would certainly turn their attention!
I think as Christians we need to be careful whom we judge as “truthful or false”, as God himself may choose to use this man and others to bring souls into His kingdom. All we need to do is look to the bible for examples of God using imperfect messengers. How embarrassing for you if God has decided to use Randy and you have judged him, written him up and caused hearts to turn….
Excuse me Lb1, but I used to believe in Randy Clark. I no longer do. Why? Because his teachings are not in the bible. We are called to judge the work and teachings of others. Pay attention to your bible and stop following false teachers!
M’Kayla, you just mentioned that his teachings is not Biblical. It seems to me that you haven’t understood the Bible from the start. Randy is a man of God, and he has lead many to Christ. Regarding impartations, God always uses people to accomplish his will. Mark 16, mentions that believers will lay their hands on the sick and they will recover.
It is so sad to see believers do this. You also mention that in their meetings they shake, and do funny staff. Have we worked God out already?. Does our personal experience put a frame to God, and anything outside of that is wrong. I attended his conference and he layed his hands on me. Since then I have been praying on the sick in the name of Jesus, and many are getting healed and saved. Praise and glory be to God. I am so sad by your post.
yvon, I would like for you to show me scripture where the things Randy teaches and the manifestations of the flesh, aka falling down, shaking, laughter is found in the word of God. Yeah, we can say that we lay hands on the sick and they recover. Do they? If you are supporting and teaching the things Randy Clark does, you are leading people to another “jesus” and not to the Messiah taught of in the bible. You can excuse it any way you want but the bottom line is that Randy Clark’s teachings are not the same as the teachings of Christ.
Let me warn you. It is one thing to come in the name of the Lord, but the proof of who you follow must line up with scripture. If it does not, you are not a child of God, and you are not saved and will face the wrath of the Most High.
I know these teachings because I used to follow them and teach them. The Lord showed me the truth and it was not an easy time for me. I pray you seek Him with all of your heart so that He will show you the same as what He did me, and many others who come here.
Again, where are your supporting scriptures? They will not be found. You my dear, are in great danger. Start here – Galatians 1:8 – But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed.
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randy clark has a book on the very thing that is something we should stay away from and that is healing energy, reki energy healing. when he teachs about healing its mostly testimonies to build faith and then he prays for them and they get healed just as jesus prayed for the sick and people got healed. be careful what you judge
No, the claimed healing of Randy Clark is NOT the healing of Christ. He is channeling that same energy you mentioned – reiki, kundalini, chi.
Hi M’Kayla, It’s GreatHeart agian,
This thread really shows how satan is gearing up for the last days when he and his false prophet will be doing “signs and lying wonders” as 2 Thes 2:9 says. Sad that so many are “ready” to be deceived. They say “but Randy is constantly giving Jesus the glory”. It would be funny if it weren’t so tragic. Of course he is. That is how false prophets operate. They appear as angels of light. That’s how they deceive!
I sat in a meeting, as I pointed out before, with crippled folks in wheelchairs. They were obviously desiring to be healed. Randy Clark ignored them and called on everyone with metal in their bodies (obviously it was maladies that were invisible to the eye). The thought that anyone could relate that to Jesus is unbelievable. Do you really believe Jesus would operate like that?
Oh yes, he is constantly saying how all he can do is ask. He says that right between the times he talks about “imparting his anointing” to others. You can get it from him, but he’s not calling attention to himself.
I believe, nay, I know Jesus can heal. I ask Him to quite frequently. I pray for the manifestations of the Spirit, and I long to see God’s power to stop the mouths of those who militate against Him and to glorify our Creator and Heavenly Father. But He, as God, get to choose when. So I have made a covenant with my own heart and with Him, that I will not accept anything but the real thing, and I “try the spirits”.
Rather than glorify Him, these fakes give opportunity for blasphemers. The Spirit, through Paul warns the Corinthian believers to control their speaking in tongues so that unbelievers won’t think they are crazy (1 Cor 14:23), then further down in the same passage He says, “For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.” 1Co 14:33. This begs the question, “Do they even have Bibles in Toronto?”
Bless you M’kayla
I have no interest in the conferences at Bethel or anywhere else – it just doesn’t draw me at all. I have attended a few of those in the past and did not care for the manifestations. I also am very spiritually sensitive, having come out of a heavy New Age background, and there were things that seemed too close to the line and times when I did not discern a good spirit.
AT THE SAME TIME, I have to say that you seem incredibly harsh and judgmental. I know some very sincere Christians who are going to some of these conferences because they want to be all that Christ has purposed them to be. They may not be discerning everything correctly – but they love God and are seeking Him. None of us have “arrived”.
I much prefer the critiques of someone like Randy Alcorn, who writes with compassion and grace, leaving the judgement of men to God and simply writing a viewpoint with Scriptural references for why He agrees or disagrees with the subject.
Your harsh judgement of persons does not come across to me as Scriptural. Yes, we are to discern, and certainly Jesus used some harsh words at times – but His directions to us were “Judge not, lest you be judged.”
I think your blog would be much more effective and God honoring if you would stick to offering your Scriptural discernment of the particular topics you are concerned about and dispense with the critical name calling and character assassination of men who profess to belong to God. That is not your place to judge – in my humble opinion.
Discuss the problems you see with their teachings or practices but please stop the violence. Even if you were talking about someone who was intentionally evil – our battle is still not against flesh and blood but against the powers and principalities of this dark world. Assassinate them.
And let me be the first to admit that as I say this to you I say it to me also, as I am guilty also of judgement and character assassination, especially of those whom I fear, or of those whom I fear becoming.
God bless you.
Anne, ridiculous – period. The false healing movement is in part what I came out of. So when you say that I should stick to particular topics, this is one of the major ones. But then, I am free to branch out and reveal other things as the Lord shows. Or is it you who decides what I print? I am not so certain what you are so offended at exactly. Your understanding of “judge not” is incorrect. We are called to judge teaching and prophecies, we are called to reveal false teachers, to confront them, to warn others and to get away from them. Have you not read these scriptures? There are many of them throughout the bible and have been written about and discussed here on my blog since 6/2009. You tell me to not judge, yet you have turned and done exactly that here to me. You do not know me or my intent. Violence? Assassination? How dramatic and unwarranted. Should I instead allow the deceive to go unwarned? Would that better suit you? Are these the teachings you read in the word of God?
Praise God for your obedience my sister. May you continue to grow in the knowledge and earning of God so that you may become even more like Jesus.
My church has begun to deal with this ministry and I am now leaving however on the way out I told them that I would supply materials to support my distrust in the Randy Clarks ministry.
Please correct your typos you say “we” repeatedly . Based off of the context of this post; I am sure what you mean to say is “where were we”. May Gods excellence continue to rest on you.
Let no one despise your youth and dismiss this truth because of those typos.
They aren’t typos.
What about Romans 1:11 Paul talks about imparting a spiritual gift to strengthen the believer. What does that mean then?
Context, keep reading. You can’t dwell on one verse alone.
What is it called when a faith healer puts their hand above your head and asks the Holy Spirit to come in after confessing sin and taking it to the cross and reckoning it dead and then to renew in you a right spirit? You then experience a warm melting feeling of love enter your mind and reach your inner womb and strengthen you. this area in your stomach is where you are able to draw power from to keep your mind free and unblocked from heaviness.
Brenda, There is no biblical evidence of these events being true of Christianity. We do not draw power from our stomach areas. The power belongs to the Lord and him only.
This is called Reiki and it is New Age. Just because it uses Christian terminology doesn’t mean it changes the danger of it. Please google. Very dangerous for inviting familiar spirits.
Reiki is actually a Japanese healing method that has become quite popular throughout the health care industry here in the US. Years back I connected the “power” found in IAHR with Reiki and other methods found in varied beliefs throughout the world.
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It seems I have been duped. John 17:3- to know God is eternal life. How do we know a supernatural God apart from our senses. Jesus says in John 6- the words that I give you are spirit and life to those who find them. When I read the Bible I read it literally and have an expectation to know him by experiences. Fact, fath,and feelings was how I was taught. How can new Christians avoid getting into error and mystic experiences when believing they come from the Bible? My mind and body are oppressed. There are so many people who have followers of Jesus but now find themselves tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine and in ship wreck from being involved in the inner healing movement . What can you tell me above Paula and John Sanford? What ministries give solid biblical doctrine? Are there any on tbn.?
Brenda, unfortunately, most “ministries” are not truly Christian. TBN is one of those. We know who God is through teaching of scripture. John 1 tells us that Jesus is the Word. Most so called ministries have tossed out the bible and teach followers to rely on feelings and experiences, which is very dangerous and will never lead us to truth. Satan can create experiences that may seem convincing (remember the rods in Pharaoh’s court), and the bible tells us that our hearts are wicked – which applies to emotions and thoughts as well. Read the bible and pray for truth. If you find you need to repent for things you have believed or practiced, then do so. Just hang on and believe that the Lord will reveal himself and his will to you through his word as you begin to know him. It is amazing that you referenced John 17, the prayer Jesus sent on behalf of all who would believe in him. Be encouraged! 🙂
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I am going through the hardest season of my life and I don’t understand how to know God apart from feelings especially when scripture and feelings seem to go together. What does it mean to be filled with the spirit? I do know what empty is and I do know when I feel like my guts and head are in a vice. I don’t know if I can trust my mind again. I went from the frying pan into the fire. You didn’t answer my question about Paula and John Sanford? Were they into new age like their mentor Agnes Sanford? You can send me a private message. I think the lord has given me over to the enemy for the saving of my soul.
Brenda, I don’t think the Lord has given you over the to the enemy, especially that you are seeking the truth! I keep hearing “feeling” from you. Feelings do not determine truth, feelings often lie and are based on emotions. What does the word of God say to someone in your condition? God is faithful! As for the question regarding the Sanfords – avoid them, all of them – whether new age or no, they teach outside true doctrine. At this point I would put aside what it means “to be filled with the Spirit” and focus on a bit of time in the bible and prayer. Spend some time doing things that you like to do and avoid overthinking!
Proverbs 3:5Trust in the LORD with all your heart,And do not lean on your own understanding. 6In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He will make your paths straight.
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Dear sister (and brothers who might read),
I have read this blog for years now, and I am thankful for it. I have been walking with the Lord for more than 40 years. When I was a new believer, a friend took me to a big church in Houston. The son of the man who is now pastor there was pastor then. They had a guest speaker, Kenneth Hagin. He made the statement while he was preaching, “God never used sickness”.
I was a new believer, but I had read 2 Samuel, and I knew that God HAD used sickness when He disciplined the nation of Israel after David’s sin of numbering the tribe of Israel. The Holy Spirit immediately began to cry out within me against the false teaching. I made a decision at that moment. Everyone around me was cheering and saying amen, but I chose to listen to the Spirit. Maybe I should say the Holy Spirit, because there was definitely a different spirit there.
A Christ follower must always listen to the Holy Spirit and make choices. Jesus said, “beware of covetousness, for one’s life does not consist in the abundance of the things he possesses.” (Luke 12:15)
The false teachers ignore this verse and even teach about the precious life, (which John said was “in Him” John 1:4; so Jesus brought it with Him when He came down from heaven) of which Jesus said He came to bring us abundantly (John 10:10), that He was talking about having the power to get what you want in this world (please refer back to Luke 12:15). This is almost always a part of the other false teachings on impartations and such.
Here’s how you avoid this fleshly nonsense and stay strong and productive for the kingdom, even though (and beware, don’t under estimate the strength of your own flesh. It wants this world and its goods! see 1John 2:15) the enemy has all these kinds of devices to pull you away from Christ to materialism and a false sense of mystic power (which by the way, poor Paul and the other apostles didn’t have; they died, having lost everything in this world for the name of Christ. They made many disciples as the Lord commanded them to, but they never “claimed a city for Jesus” or any of that nonsense.)
1. Understand that when Jesus said “Whoever desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow Me” (Mark 8:34) Jesus was saying that to follow Him, we must be constantly be in a state of death to self (the effect of the cross!) as we follow Him. This destroys inner healing (If the old me is being put to death by the cross, how can I listen to the ‘angel of light’ telling me to heal self?). The reason inner healing gets any traction (please don’t take this statement as a personal attack, it is meant simply as a statement of fact that if considered, will help the hearer) is because we are not willing to simply obey Jesus and “deny” our-self.
2. Understand that your victorious walk for Jesus doesn’t in any way depend on your “self”. It completely depends on the presence of Jesus in you. The more you deny yourself, the more Jesus fills you. The moment you begin to focus on self, you begin to exclude the real power and presence of Jesus. You have some terrible memories? Understand that they are all part of the “old things” which 2 Corinthians 5:17 says are “passed away”. If the enemy can keep you focused on “self” you are useless to God. The disciples didn’t go forth in power, all the while worrying about their memories and feelings! They went in the knowledge that they could do all things through the One who strengthened them. Cry out to Jesus! Obey Him! Take up the cross He offers to share with you and deny yourself. Live for Him and not you. Ironically, when you live for Him and not yourself, you will find a freedom from the pain of the past, and joy in the presence and hope for the future.
Most every tool in the enemies arsenal of snares is rendered useless to him, when we deny ourselves. He was unable to conquer Jesus with his pitiful temptations, and he still is unable. If he finds us full of Jesus when he comes to tempt us, he loses every time. If he finds us full of our freshly “healed” selves, he will have a field day and we will not stand.
Lastly, see yourself as Paul saw himself: a living sacrifice. Living in the world, but not of the world. Paul said to Timothy, “For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. But you be watchful in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.
For I am already being poured out as a drink offering,
(do you see yourself as an offering to God, or as a whining baby always wanting something? Big difference huh?)
and the time of my departure is at hand. I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith. Finally, there is laid up for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will give to me on that Day, and not to me only but also to all who have loved His appearing. ”
I hope to see you all at the marriage supper!
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Like a drink of fresh water reading this. Thanks for writing. So true 🙂
Wow, another blog online simply to destroy, not edify people. I am amazed at how many Christians fall for people whose main goal and purpose is to steal, kill, and destroy others instead of building up. It is clear that your focus is on destruction and death, not on the blessings of God. I pray your vision shifts to where you can bless people around you instead of cursing. Praying…
Oh my and yet another person who chooses experience over biblical truth. Open your bible my friend and search the scriptures before it is too late!
Not sure what you read that lead you to think this blog is attacking rather than building up people? I have read quite a lot on this site in the last while. I’ve found great encouragement here and have been edified and blessed.
That is a blessing, Joy! Thank you.
I have been experiencing depression and can hardly get out of bed or get anything done around the house. I just wanted to be a normal Christian and instead fell into deception. Can you hook me up with some people who are able to discern bible truth before it is too late. I am having trouble with familiar spirits that are afflicting my body and mind. Please help because I am in torment.
Bogged down, the best place for you to be is in front of the Lord in repentance. Fill your mind with the scriptures and continue to pray. The familiar spirits will leave you. Read the article “Freedom from False Spirits of Revival” posted on the header as it is a great source of help and information.
Hi Bogged down,
God bless you in your struggle. My humble advice would be in 2 steps:
1. Kneel and fervently call on the Lord. Pour you heart out to Him and re-state your commitment to Him and your desire to yield completely to His will. Deny yourself, take up the cross and follow.
2. Meditate on this… Php 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthy—meditate on these things.
I am praying for you
Thank you Pastor Mike, I will continue to do as you say. I am experiencing strange manifestations. My skin is hypersensitive and it doesn’t seem to be getting better.
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Brenda, I went through this too. Manifestations can linger and can be caused for different reasons. One is that Satan is trying to trick you, another is an act of the mind in the form of conditioning. Stand strong and keep believing, stay in prayer and the word of God. The manifestations will cease.
Did you read the article and make use of its information?
Let me know how you are.
Thanks I will. Please keep me in your prayers. How long does it take to get free from this junk?
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Thank u for your prayers!
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I had the opportunity to attend few “Global awakening” teaching with a group of Randy’s Clark students. It’s the global school they have were they send the students to travel around the US to provide their partner churches a free supernatural workshops, healing services and impartation. I’m not a fan of the hyper-grace, word faith/name it an claim it movement. But I’m always curious on these events and pray God will not allow me to be deceived. On this particular even I witness some healing (not everybody was healed), the ones that weren’t heal they advised could be healed as time passes. In their teaching they kind of suggested that people’s healing has to do with their faith. I don’t believe that. As we all know about our biblical Paul having the thorn in flesh.
They mentioned the revival in Toronto, was super uncomfortable with that – as I believe other spirits showed up at that event that was not godly.
However the people that were doing the teaching at this event are super nice and sincere. They all gave their experience and I noticed that that part of their ministry was a true act of God. How can some part be so on point and other part not? Can God still operate on those attendees that are sincere?
Yes, they are very sincere in teaching what they believe to be true. I was certainly very sincere when I spoke out what I beveled to be prophetic words, when I laid my hands on people to be healed or receive deliverance and when I interpreted dreams on the behalf of another…on and on..
Sincerity is nothing when the basis of the teaching is on false doctrine. I don’t believe God moves in these gatherings any more than I believe people are truly healed. Remember, the devil comes as an angel of light, and that Jesus said many would come in His name and be deceived. When minsters part from sound teaching everything that comes after that is false, is demonic. I know it is hard to grasp, but again, confusion is of the enemy.
You said some were healed. Healed of what? did you see people who had observable handicaps miraculously made whole (twisted limbs, palsy, psoriasis, burns,)?
The reason I ask is, I was at a meeting where Clark claimed something like 100 healings and it was a total farce. He ignored those with any observable maladies and told those who had metal implants or pins in their bodies to stand and begin to move the area where the metal was and God would heal them so they would have more movement. He then brow beat them to keep moving until they got their healing. You could see most everyone of them finally got embarrassed enough until they raised their hands signifying they had their healings so they could sit down. Incidentally there were a dozen or more in wheel chairs there he totally ignored. It was sickening to watch. If you saw some real, observable miraculous healings, your experience with Clark is totally different from mine.
SORRY I MEANT TO SAY “That’s why I pray diligently that the Holy Spirit would NOT allow me to fall back into deception”.
Maybe you didn’t see my question above. Could you answer it please?
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Deception stinks! I traveled the Randy Clark / Bill Johnson circles over a decade ago, got really into it, didn’t do Sozo training but went to conferences and was near Bill and others. When I realized the possible deception, I choose to read Bible only for many months. It’s amazing how different reading just bible and praying felt, versus reading their (faith healer) books and practicing their teachings. That word faith is such a huge area – I was familiar with Elijah List and other prophetic stuff, New Apostolic Reformation (Wagner), 7 mountains, healing rooms, etc.
For me the key kind of boils down to my will or God’s will. Do I want power? Do I want to change lives? And a deeper and harder question is, whose glory am I seeking? It is often difficult to deal honestly and deeply with these questions. But I do think the allure of the deception comes down to pride. I wanted to see God’s glory, I wanted to conquer giants, I wanted to usher in God’s kingdom. But the bible teaches a very different story than me having control over the reality around me.
This is the only article I’ve read of yours, and I see my comment is years after the last one. But interestingly, I was traveling those circles when you published this article. Thank you for the discernment you had and for writing on the subject. I hope it keeps others from falling into deception, and promotes discernment, healthy relationship with Jesus and good understanding of biblical truth.
God bless you all as we follow Jesus.