Warning to the Apostles – Andrew Strom

I received this warning from Andrew Strom in my e-mail this morning. Another ditto to those who do the same work in exposing these false apostles, prophets and teachers of the NAR and Manifest Sons. So for those who go in the same way, walk out.

WARNING to THE “APOSTLES”
-Andrew Strom.

An Open Letter to Peter Wagner, Dutch Sheets & Other “Apostles”.

I recently received a report of a new “Apostolic Network” headed up by Dutch Sheets which held a gathering in Florida last week to “carve up” territories for it’s ‘apostles’, etc. (link here -added by M’Kayla) I need to put in writing what I believe the Lord would say to these men.

But first I need to remind us all of something. On June 23rd, 2008, a group of “apostles and prophets” under Peter Wagner’s headship stood on a stage in Lakeland at the Todd Bentley revival – to lay on hands and commission him, etc. But it was far more than that. Peter Wagner called it an “apostolic alignment.” He made the following statement before all the TV cameras and all the people:

“I take the apostolic authority that God has given me and I decree to Todd Bentley:
-Your power will increase.
-Your authority will increase.
-Your favor will increase.
-Your influence will increase.
-Your revelation will increase.
I also decree that:
-A new supernatural strength will flow through this ministry.
-A new life force will penetrate this move of God…”

Onlookers might have thought that Wagner was ‘prophesying’ the above statements. But actually what he felt he was doing was “decreeing” these things over Todd – since he was the ‘head apostle’.  In a letter the following day, Wagner called this a “groundbreaking event” and stated that, “We are now in a place in what I see as the Second Apostolic Age…” (In other words, a “new era” of real apostles).

So how did that work out for you, Peter? Well, literally within weeks we found out that many of the “miracles” at Lakeland had no foundation, and then Todd Bentley’s wife separated from him apparently over an affair he was having – and the entire ‘revival’ fell to pieces in the worst way possible. That’s how it worked out.

All the big Charismatic leaders that had stood on that stage hardly knew what to do with themselves – they were so embarrassed. And none more so than Peter Wagner – after making an “Apostolic decree” like that. -Probably the most colossal disaster of his life.

So who pulled the rug out from under your “apostolic alignment”, Peter? I need to tell you that there are two responsible parties. One is ‘yourself’ – clearly. And the second is GOD – because He is now pitted against you and your so-called “apostles”. He is the one who did this to you.

You and your friends have presumed to an office and a place over the Body that is simply not yours, and God is in the process of taking you ‘apostles’ down – and all your “networks” with you.

Dutch Sheets – can I ask you please, what gives you the right to carve up the Body of Christ in North America and parcel it out like McDonald’s franchises to all your buddies so they can be ‘apostles’ over their own “territory”? Do you have any idea what you are playing with? Don’t you know that if your buddies are not real New Testament Apostles then all they are doing is painting huge targets on themselves and begging for the judgment of God?
How dare you treat the Body of Christ like a piece of Real Estate that you can carve up for your own aggrandizement?

Because of men like you, God is about to judge the leadership of the church. Do they call themselves an “apostle”? Well, God is going to put them to the test. If they are not the real thing, they make themselves His ‘enemy’ because they are blocking His real Reformation. Every self-proclaimed “apostle and prophet” is about to be put to the test. Oh, you call your group an “Apostolic Council of Elders” or something similar? Expect God to come calling, and if you are not the real thing, expect Him to take you down. The Lord God is coming to take back His church with great violence. And you guys are standing directly in His way.

I’ve heard that one of these big “apostles” in Canada once told his network that their “apostle-ness” would be judged by the ‘noses and nickels’ that they represented. (In other words, their “numbers”
and their reaping of money). Hmmmm. If I didn’t know better, I would call those the words of a hireling and a wolf.

As Lee Grady wrote about this ‘Apostle-Mania’:
“In some circles apostles demanded total allegiance from the leaders who were “under” them. Some required a policy of “tithing up,” creating a monstrous organizational structure similar to a spiritual Amway. So-called apostles with huge “downlines” made exorbitant amounts of money. One leader even offered pastors the opportunity to become “spiritual sons” by contributing $1,000 a month to his ministry.”

And yet here is what the TRUE apostle Paul wrote: “I think that God has set forth us the apostles last, as it were appointed to death… we both hunger, and thirst, and are naked, and are buffeted, and have no certain dwelling place… we are made as the filth of the world, and are the off scouring of all things…” (1 Cor 4:9-13).

Now THAT is true apostleship. Tell me, Mr. Modern Apostle, do you match up to the New Testament apostles? If not, what on earth do you think God is going to do to you if you claim that title falsely?

I believe that many true Apostles, when they do arise, will simply REFUSE to carry such titles in any way. They will “minimize” themselves, not exalt themselves. That is the heart of a true leader of God.

In closing, let me again warn those who have titled themselves “apostle” or ‘prophet’ in the modern church. God is coming to “clean house” and if you are not the real deal, expect Him to start with you. It is as simple as that. You need to repent urgently of your utter presumption. You have been warned.

Send feedback to-  prophetic@revivalschool.com

God bless you all.

Andrew Strom.

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27 thoughts on “Warning to the Apostles – Andrew Strom

  1. On the NAR “carving up the territory”: all this means is that they are following in the footsteps of every denomination since the RCC. Staking their claim and appointing ‘bishops’ over regions, as nearly every religious institution in the world has always done. They just use different terminology.

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    • Hi Ian.
      Yes, there isn’t so much of a difference. These come to their pulpits claiming God told me, God said this and that, God gave me a dream, a word, a prophetic utterance, and so lead their congregants down that road, making thier plan, bringing money and time to an event or plan that is not laid out in the word. And because there is such a large sum of cash along with such a large group of people the thing seems SUCCESSFUL and it is attributed to a true work of God!

      What’s worse is that they use numerology which is of the occult along with scripture to make sound more spiritual than it truly is. People these days are more into the “oohs and aahhs” than they are the word of God. Every time I read a story of another kingdom going up, I can’t help but think of the Tower of Babel.

      Who knows if God will judge them in this life or if they will continue in this error until they die and then face Him. (Many have) But face Him they will as we all must and that alone should be enough -that we would all want to know we are in right standing – to our bibles and our knees. Vain imaginings won’t hold up in the Throne Room in that day.

      That is why we warn others to be sure of those who follow, that they too follow Jesus Christ and not an imitation.

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  2. Wagner and co are doing nothing less than making merchandise of the flock, and in my opinion, they are the ” buyers and sellers” mentioned in scripture.Take the time to study the effect that the buyers and sellers have on the church [ the five dumb virgins, the merchants in the temple and the mark of the beast] and one will see that their actions are nothing less than destructive to those who follow these men.I think that warning the merchants is a waste of time , but there is time for those who are blindly following their teaching and are beimg swallowed up in their deception.Time is short!

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    • Ray, you could be right in that it is too late for the leaders, given they have so much wrapped up in their works. But maybe not. And in warning, maybe the followers will take notice. God only knows what can come out of revealing the truth.

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  3. I receive regular emails from Andrew Strom, most of what I receive I appreciate and agree with. The first thin that came to my mind regarding this proclamation from the NAR, is…”What AUDACITY.” Those in the NAR are at best short-sighted at best. The seem to forget that there are those who have tested and weighed their words, the character, about who THEY deem are qualified to minister amongst the brethren. I n every one of these areas they are found seriously wanting.

    And yet, no matter how many enumerated heresies, no matter how many false prophecies, doctrine crafted out of their own imaginations, some are nothing more than doctrines from demons, they keep insisting they are IT.

    Really? Really now?? My intention si to write many of them and ask this…becuae I think it should be asked. What if we don’t submit under your “leadership?” because very few pastors, teachers, seminarians, in this country agree, let alone care what you believe about yourself. In fact, many have very little to say positive based on your character sin that is running rampant amongst you. Are we really going to have top succumb to Bob Jones falsehoods, after he was exposed as a serial sexual. Or Bentley, who is still living in sexual sin, who is an unrepentant adulterer.

    Are we to really trust the Joyner’s, who after almost tow decades in the pulpit, proclaimed after he began the “restoration” process of Bentley that he felt it was time to craft a doctrine of divorce? Many would think long before he strolled into a pulpit, into a leadership role, that would have at least been addressed, and his convictions would have been rooted and grounded in the Word.

    But, in my mind here’s the issue. We are warned…that in the end, mens’ deviance, their lies, their financial Ponzi schemes, their and deception will increase. Not their godliness, holiness, and demonstrating there are growing in the faith, and the faith once given. NO…more and more will depart and take those who CHOOSE manifestations, signs and wonders..for the sake of signs and wonders, who look at ministry as a means of financial gain..those are the characteristics of falsehood…of who we are to have nothing to do with. And let me add…those to whom we are called and to confront, to rebuke, to plead with as well to repent and to turn back to their First Love. Sadly, the more I read and what I witness, is they are becoming more emboldened, and enamored with themselves and their alleged callings and gifts.

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  4. Friday, February 26, 2010

    “Not Everything Needs Exposed,” from “My Daily Wash” the blog of Pastor Jeff Jacob of Word of Life International Church in Ashburn, VA, (my home church). You can read his blog at .

    Read this excerpt from his blog. May it speak to your hearts. It is one thing to expose false doctrine to keep others from following it, but it is another to judge the people.

    Scripture:
    Genesis 9:23 “Then Shem and Japheth took a robe, held it over their shoulders, and backed into the tent to cover their father. As they did this, they looked the other way so they would not see him naked”.

    Observation:
    Noah had been drinking some of his home-made wine and ended up naked and drunk. Ham came in, saw him, and ran immediately to his brothers to tell them the news. Shem and Japheth walked backwards into the tent carrying a cover to cover their father’s nakedness without looking themselves. Ham was cursed from that day forward and Shem and Japheth were blessed from that day forward.

    Application:
    Today we have so many witch hunters and false teaching hunters in the body of Christ who get some kind of thrill out of seeing people exposed for their mistakes. It seems really holy to expose someone else’s weaknesses. It is not. In the New Covenant those who are spiritual are to restore such a person and bring healing. Sin and wrong doing always comes out and is exposed, but we shouldn’t be the ones pointing out and looking at the mistakes in everyone else’s lives. We are to build one another up in the most holy faith instead of tearing apart the body of Christ. Exposing someone else’s shortcomings simply shows your own level of maturity.

    Prayer:
    Father, You are the God of all truth and You know all truth. You know when someone messes up and when they live holy. You are the perfect judge who will judge the living and the dead. teach us not to judge and criticize each other in Your family. Teach us what needs exposed and what needs to be forgiven and put to rest. Show us how to walk in love and develop into maturity. I want to live a life pleasing to You. Help me on my journey.

    Jeff
    Posted by Jeff Jacob at 5:32 AM

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    • JD, exposing liars and false teachers is not judging. Why do you come here with such an accusation? I don’t see the conncection between exposing a false teacher and exposing nakedness, do you?? The men spoken against in this article are far from “weak, or those who makes mistakes”, they are dangerous wolves, or don’t you see that? I get no thrill from exposing those who flat out lie to others leading them astray for the sole purpose of builing their own kindgom and I don’t appreciate the implication that I do! It is grievous to me as I watch and see others so deceived as I was, and by the same teachers! And it should be just as grievous to you as it should for all of us! We are told over and again in the bible to expose the false teachers who come in the name of Jesus. The church is in the situation it is in today because it people did not stand against the heresy! Who are you to come here and tell me otherwise?

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    • JD, I’ve just reread your comment. This is not the first time you and I have butted heads. I know that either you don’t agree with my conclusions or that you don’t bother to see the bigger picture. I’ve done my best to explain my position, and again you come here with the same complaints as in the past. So, to be clear, why don’t YOU explain to me what you mean by your comment –
      It is one thing to expose false doctrine to keep others from following it, but it is another to judge the people.
      1. How exactly am I judging the people and
      2. How should I be handling the exposure of false doctrine.

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    • I think Jeff is confused; compare these 2 statements by him:

      a. “It is one thing to expose false doctrine to keep others from following it, but it is another to judge the people.”

      b. “Today we have so many witch hunters and false teaching hunters in the body of Christ who get some kind of thrill out of seeing people exposed for their mistakes.”

      Anyone see the contradiction here?

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      • I would say comment B is a judgment. Comment A says not to, and comment B does it.

        At the very least it is presumptious and shouldn’t be used as a blanket statement. Maybe some “hunters” get a thrill, but that does not mean that all who uncover false teachers do. Most that I know of take no joy in the work, much less a thrill.

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  5. http://www.freedomapostolicalliance.org/
    This is the link to Dutch’s conference in Florida Andrew spoke of, found and submitted by another blogger. 🙂 It has been added to the article.

    Note the word “alliance”. Where have we heard that before? Global Alliance (Randy Clark), Revival Alliance (Bill Johnson, et al)…alliance, alliance, what are they aligning? If they do not speak or teach the word of God clearly, they do not truly come in His name.

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    • I’ve wondered about the whole “alliance” thing – perhaps they are looking for an alternative to being a part of a denomination (you know, where they would be held to specific doctrinal standards and real accountability.) Instead, they form “religious clubs” to give themselves the look of accountability and that extra boost of status.

      I noticed in the FAA statement, referred to “true reformation”. It’s become a popular buzz word, but they obviously don’t know how it comes about. TRUE REFORMATION always comes through diligent, authentic preaching and teaching of God’s Word. It has to go deep into the hearts of people before it will be seen on the surface. That takes time. Years. Decades. My guess is they’re not willing to faithfully teach Scripture week after week and let God reform as HE pleases.

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  6. I wonder what kind of attitude and behaviour will be demonstrated in the coming years, as the NAR gang, these modern day apostles and prophets, with all their various associations, organizations, meetings, decrees, and fancy schmancy websites will do when the vast majority of the Body of Christ merely snicker and dismiss these folks. While it is serious, I have to…(to keep sane), laugh in their general direction at their false bravado.

    They write so boastfully, so unequivocally about themselves, and their callings, their absolute insistence as to who they are personally, and how they recommend allegiance to themselves and their cronies.

    They believe they are ushering, bringing with force the Kingdom, decreeing things, speaking things into existence…actaully been prophesying these things for year. And every year more false prophecies…more “This IS the year”, for breakthrough, global outpouring, a shaking, a stirring, a demonstration, things you can never imagine will happen at this conference…bla, blah blah.

    The reality…sadly the North American Church is slumbering, indifferent to things like studying thyself approved, prayer, servanthood…suffering. The culture is awash in open hostility to the One who gave them breath and life. the Body seems more awash in trying to be like, relevant, and really doesn’t probably believes God hates sin.

    So for all their proclamations for…Ohhh lets’s say the past 25 years that I have been hearing these pontifications, I don’t see that what they believe about themselves and what they are accomplishing is nothing more than sensation and hype at best, increasing their deception and tactics to deceive are becoming more brazen and worst

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  7. Which has more authority, the apostolic network or the apostolic alliance? How do they cross authority? They seem to run in the same circles.

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  8. Hi Mkayla
    I think one of the questions that we should all be asking these distinguished gentlemen, is exactly who appointed them to the office of ” apostle” , or maybe closer to the truth would be ” under what pretence did you appoint yourself as an apostle”.I would be more than a little curious to learn of an answer to either question.
    I think here of when the TRUE apostle Paul confronted the TRUE apostle Peter in Gal 2 regarding circumcision.Do we see any of the so called ” apostles ” of today taking each other to task over false doctrine/ teaching? hardly, quite the opposite in fact, they fall over themselve promoting anything that shows signs of spirituality[ think Todd Bentley and co]. Any way , i think i have answered my own question.

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    • These “apostles” claim they have heard from God thru a “word” or “vision” or whatever imaginative method they utilize. Their actions will always go back to what they have heard from God – more experienced based doctrine. They believe they have a higher place in the body of Christ already, as Dutch has claimed for himself a priestly or kingly annointing. He has the ability to call down Jezebel and has a fixation with Baal who he often prays against. If you notice he mentions a scripture referring to Baal to gather money. (I think we discussed this on another article.) You’re right that they all fall over themselves – very well said – :). They’re in cahoots, hearing from the same source and so commend each other. I am sure those who have come against the NAR in the past were treated in much the same way as the men who recently stood up against Todd Bentley. Remember, during Lakeland Bill Johnson publicly read a letter from a man who asked him how he could stand with Bentley, and Johnson publicly made the questioner a joke. The crowd roared then with Johnson as they did recently with Bentley.

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  9. Pingback: Warning to “Apostles” « Redeemedhippiesplace's Weblog

  10. Mkayla,

    Here are some words for you to consider in your pursuit of outing false teachers. Nowhere in the Bible does it say to “out” the false teachers. It does however address dealing with them in the following manner:

    1.) 2 Tim 2:14, 16-18,23-26, ” 14 Keep reminding God’s people of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen.

    16 AVOID GODLESS CHATTER, because those who indulge in it will become more and more ungodly. 17 Their teaching will spread like gangrene. Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus, 18 who have departed from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some.

    23 Don’t have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. 24 And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. 25 OPPONENTS MUST BE GENTLY INSTRUCTED, IN THE HOPE THAT GOD WILL GRANT THEM REPENTANCE LEADING THEM TO A KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUTH, 26 AND THAT THEY WILL COME TO THEIR SENSES AND ESCAPE FROM THE TRAP OF THE DEVIL, WHO HAS TAKEN THEM CAPTIVE TO DO HIS WILL.”

    To you and your buddy Ian, I say, “the LORD rebuke you.” Do you ever make the gesture of trying to reach out to those who are teaching falsely in the hope of seeing them come to the truth or do you just bash everyone? JD and Jeff are correct in their position that you don’t go around bashing everyone who teaches falsely.

    Again, I say to you both and to all the witch hunters out there, the LORD rebuke you!!!!!!!!! LET HE (OR SHE) WHO IS WITHOUT SIN CAST THE FIRST STONE! Are you perfect? Who made you judge? There is only one Righteous Judge, Jesus! Are you perfect? Do you ever make mistakes? IS EVERYTHING YOU SAY THE TRUTH? CHECK YOURSELF BEFORE YOU HUNT DOWN ALL THE FALSE TEACHERS. “Judge not lest you be judge.” For with what measure you judge by that measure you will be judged.

    It is one thing to know what false teaching is and another to know how to do deal with false teaching. Why not reach out to these lost souls and lead them to Christ rather than sit back in an ivory tower and cast judgment? Think about it!

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    • JD, is there something SPECIFIC you are referring to?
      First of all I don’t sit in an ivory tower. I don’t own a tower of any kind. Second, I don’t have to hunt false teachers – I was one in a manner of speaking, or didn’t you bother to read the blog? And so it is from first hand experience that I speak from and that I have had and continue to have conversations with those who are in opposition with the bible!!! Again, these are issues openly discussed here on my blog.

      And the bible is clear on about pointing out by name those who teach false doctrine and what we are to do about them. In fact, we are given quite a bit of direction in that regard. You say NOT oust them? Are you kidding? Oust them, expose them, have nothing to do with them! – I suggest a little more research on your end.

      It seems you have done exactly what you have falsely accused us of here- idle or godless chatter, foolish and stupid arguments. Now that I have answered your questions about what I should have done or should be doing, what is it you would like me to address specifically?

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  11. First off, I never said not to “oust” them, of course we are to remove them from positions of authority and the like. I said not to “out” them meaning to drag them through the streets whether online, in print, over the airwaves, or such. Yes, Paul did mention some here and there in his letters, but do you see him going around writing letter after letter degrading this person or that person? No.

    And sister, if you had paid attention to my words, you would have known the former response was not idle chatter but a strong rebuke. The passage from 2 Tim from Paul speaks directly and clearly in how to handle those in “opposition” as he put it. If you check the header of this passage in the Bible you will note that it says “Dealing with False Teachers.”

    I am quite elated for you that you came out of the darkness you were once in and feel the need to have nothing to do with it. However, you did not answer my specific questions. Who died and made you judge, jury and executioner?

    Second unanswered question: What inroads are you making to reaching these lost souls? I read all about your naming this one and that one as being a false teacher, but nowhere in your blog do I see any love of the Father reaching out to them in love and grace and leading them to the truth. Sure, they may never come to Jesus the Messiah, and the Spirit of God may not have you go in that direction.

    The big thing specifically is this: when you do stop hurling stones and start rendering aid like the Good Samaritan. These ‘false teachers’ are wrong and should not be allowed to teach. We know that, but at what point do you stop the pointing finger of accusations and start helping these people to come out of darkness and into the light of the gospel you proclaim to preach. The last I checked the gospel is for all who will believe. God loved ‘the world’ that ‘whosoever’ should believe on him would not perish but have everlasting life. Where in that verse does it say not to reach out to the lost?

    The Great Commission tells us to preach the gospel to all creatures (people, of course). Are you preaching the ‘true’ gospel to these false teachers? You have an inside perspective not many people have. Be like Paul said and be all things to all people that you might win some to the Lord. Rather than lashing out that the NAR and WoF guys are all false teachers, why not communicate with them and speak the truth in love to them in a rebuke but also extend the grace of God to them and lead them to the truth and the light of the gospel as someone did for you. Or, have you forgotten where you came from?

    Put yourself in the position of the false teacher again just hypothetically. Now, if some one was out there blasting you all day as a false teacher, how would that make you feel? Do you see any love of God in that action? What if that person you helped lead you out of false teaching/darkness and into God’s marvelous light had chosen to just declare constantly that Mkayla is a false teacher, have nothing to do with her, and never offered the gospel to you. Is this really who you want to be, because you sure come off that way on this entire blog.

    These words may seem harsh, but they are truth spoken in love. Jesus didn’t bash you and blast you while teaching falsely. He constantly wooed you to him to accept and receive his love. Have compassion and extend mercy and grace to other. Freely you have received; freely give.

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    • However, you did not answer my specific questions. Who died and made you judge, jury and executioner?

      Ummmm…
      ~
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      ~
      thinking…
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      thinking…
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      still thinking…
      ~
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      hmmm…
      ~
      ~
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      ~
      don’t know…
      tell me…

      Like

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