C Peter Wagner in His Own Defense

Some time back I was hit with quite a bit more traffic than usual and was able to trace it back to an online magazine called Al Jezeera. There I found an interesting article regarding Rick Perry and the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR). The reason for my traffic was a link AJ made to one of the articles on my blog. So, it was with great interest that I just happened to find the following info in a google search!  Thought you’d like to see it for yourselves if you haven’t already.

C. Peter Wagner is speaking out against those who revealed what he stands for; dominionism, taking biblical control of the world by force via the seven mountains of influence, and the joining of the NAR to political America.

Volumes have been written already in exposing the false doctrine of the NAR, the organization behind what has become to be considered mainline Christianity. While some of the things that are said up front sound right, a close study of the bible and a comparison to God’s word with Wagner’s books reveal a completely different doctrine. I consider his teachings and all of the NAR activity to be doctrine of demons. (if you are one of his followers, please do some prayerful research!)

Wagner also did a bit of back-peddling after endorsing the apostate preacher Todd Bentley during the Lakeland fiasco, once it was found to be exactly that – a fiasco.

Earlier, a fellow blogger pointed out that the previously published NAR – Apostle/Prophet list I linked to another article here on my blog had disappeared. This was a handy link to have as it made it quite easy to find out if those we trust and take our doctrine from were part of the NAR. My search to find an updated copy revealed that the list is now only available to members!  See here – International Coalition of Apostles.

What could they be hiding? Maybe there is something to the fact that Chuck Pierce held some meetings last year in a Masonic Temple…Secret Societies.

Read on...I’d love your input!

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THE NEW APOSTOLIC REFORMATION

An Update by C. Peter Wagner, Ph.D.

THE NEW APOSTOLIC REFORMATION

August 18,2011

Surprisingly, the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) has recently become a topic of discussion in the political media. I noticed some mention of it in connection with Sarah Palin’s run for Vice-President, but I considered it relatively insignificant. Then more talk of the NAR surfaced around Michelle Bachman, but it soared to a new level when Rick Perry entered the race for the Republican nomination for President in August. The best I can discern, the NAR has become a tool in the hands of certain liberal opponents of the conservative candidates designed to discredit them on the basis of their friendship with certain Christian leaders supposedly affiliated with the NAR. To bolster this attempt, they seek to accuse the NAR of teaching false doctrine and paste on it the label of “cult.” For example, Forgotten Word Ministries posts an article by Marsha West expressing concerns about Rick Perry’s prayer assembly in Houston on August 6, that uses the title: “Texas Governor’s Upcoming Leadership Event Includes Cult Members.”[1]

Soon after the event, nothing less than Al Jazeera News picked up on the theme and posted an article on the NAR under the title “America’s own Taliban.” My name comes up in most of the Internet postings on NAR, but in this one I am called the “intellectual godfather” of the movement.[2] When I read that, I felt that I had a responsibility to attempt to bring some clarification as to what the NAR is, what are its goals, and how these goals are being implemented. That is why I am writing this brief paper.

What Is the NAR?

The NAR is definitely not a cult. Those who affiliate with it believe the Apostles’ Creed and all the standard classic statements of Christian doctrine. It will surprise some to know that the NAR embraces the largest non-Catholic segment of world Christianity. It is also the fastest growing segment, the only segment of Christianity currently growing faster than the world population and faster than Islam.[3] Christianity is booming now in the Global South which includes sub-Saharan Africa, Latin America, and large parts of Asia. Most of the new churches in the Global South, even including many which belong to denominations, would comfortably fit the NAR template.

The NAR represents the most radical change in the way of doing church since the Protestant Reformation. This is not a doctrinal change. We adhere to the major tenets of the Reformation: the authority of Scripture, justification by faith, and the priesthood of all believers. But the quality of church life, the governance of the church, the worship, the theology of prayer, the missional goals, the optimistic vision for the future, and other features, constitute quite a change from traditional Protestantism.

The NAR is not an organization. No one can join or carry a card. It has no leader. I have been called the “founder,” but this is not the case. One reason I might be seen as an “intellectual godfather” is that I might have been the first to observe the movement, give a name to it, and describe its characteristics as I saw them. When this began to come together through my research in 1993, I was Professor of Church Growth at Fuller Theological Seminary, where I taught for 30 years. The roots of the NAR go back to the beginning of the African Independent Church Movement in 1900, the Chinese House Church Movement beginning in 1976, the U.S. Independent Charismatic Movement beginning in the 1970s and the Latin American Grassroots Church Movement beginning around the same time. I was neither the founder nor a member of any of these movements, I was simply a professor who observed that they were the fastest growing churches in their respective regions and that they had a number of common characteristics.

If I was going to write about this phenomenal move of the Holy Spirit, I knew I had to give it a name. I tried “Postdenominational” but soon dropped it because of the objections of many of my friends who were denominational executives. Then, in 1994, I tested “New Apostolic Reformation.” “Reformation” because the movement matched the Protestant Reformation in world impact; “Apostolic” because of all the changes the most radical one was apostolic governance, which I’ll explain in due time; and “New” because several churches and denominations already carried the name “apostolic,” but they did not fit the NAR pattern. Other names of this movement which are more or less synonymous with NAR have been “Neopentecostal,” “Neocharismatic,” “Independent,” or “Nondenominational.”

I am rather fascinated at the lists of individuals whom the media glibly connects with the NAR. I’m sure that some of them wouldn’t even recognize the term. In many cases, however, they would fit the NAR template, but since the NAR has no membership list they themselves would need to say whether they consider themselves affiliated or not.

For those who might be interested in such things, the books I have written related to NAR include The New Apostolic Churches (1998); Churchquake! (1999); Apostles and Prophets (2000), Changing Church (2004); and Apostles Today (2006). These are all available on amazon.com.

Concerns about the NAR

If the critics are using openness to NAR as a slur against conservative political candidates, they obviously need to verbalize what could be wrong with NAR in the first place. To suppose that NAR is a “cult” or that it teaches “heresy” can be attributed only to sloppy or immature journalism. All too often “heresy” has come to mean only that the person disagrees with me and my friends, but the purpose of using the word is to project guilt by association on the politician. It attempts to implant a question: Who would vote for a heretic? But there is little evidence presented that the issue in question incorporates the doctrinal unorthodoxy of a true heresy. Instead, key words are usually dropped which describe legitimate areas of disagreement among Christian theologians on the level of whether or not we baptize infants. Neither of the opposite positions on matters like this deserve to be placed in the category of heresy.

Let me review the media pieces I have collected and pick out some key words in order to clarify my position. I say “my position,” because others in NAR might not agree with me, and they are not compelled to do so. NAR has no official statements of theology or ecclesiology, although a large number of us do happen to agree upon many somewhat radical conclusions. Most of us have long track records of service within traditional Christianity, and we have needed to go through paradigm shifts to get where we are now. Keep in mind that one of the affects of every paradigm shift is that some people get pulled out of their comfort zones. One of the reasons for opposition to some of the more radical ideas of NAR is that certain people have decided not to change and they are upset with those who have chosen to change.
Apostolic governance.As I mentioned before, this is probably the most radical change. I take literally St. Paul’s words that Jesus, at His ascension into heaven, “gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry” (Ephesians 4:11-12). Most of traditional Christianity accepts evangelists, pastors, and teachers, but not apostles and prophets. I think that all five are given to be active in churches today. In fact, St. Paul goes on to say, “And God has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers…” (1 Corinthians 12:28). This does not describe a hierarchy, but a divine order. Apostles are first in that order.
I strongly object to journalists using the adjective “self-appointed” or “self-declared” when referring to apostles. No true apostle is self-appointed. First of all, they are gifted by God for that ministry. Secondly, the gift and its fruit are recognized by peers and the apostle is “set in” or “commissioned” to the office of apostle by other respected and qualified leaders.

The office of prophet. Prophets are prominent in the Bible, both in the Old Testament and in the New Testament. As we just saw above, apostles are first and prophets are second. Every apostle needs alignment with prophets and every prophet needs apostolic alignment. One of the reasons why both should be active in our churches today is that the Bible says, “Surely God does nothing unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets” (Amos 3:7). And also: “Believe in the Lord your God and you shall be established; believe His prophets and you shall prosper” (2 Chronicles 20:20). I want to prosper and I want you to prosper.

Dominionism. This refers to the desire that some of my friends and I have to follow Jesus and do what He wants. One of the things He does want He taught us to pray for in the Lord’s Prayer: “Your kingdom come, Your will be done on earth as it is in heaven.” This means that we do our best to see that what we know is characteristic of heaven work its way into the warp and woof of our society here on earth. Think of heaven: no injustice, no poverty, righteousness, peace, prosperity, no disease, love, no corruption, no crime, no misery, no racism, and I could go on. Wouldn’t you like your city to display those characteristics?

But where does dominion come in? On the first page of the Bible, God told Adam and Eve to “fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, etc.” (Genesis 1:28). Adam, Eve, and the whole human race were to take dominion over the rest of creation, but Satan entered the picture, succeeded in usurping Adam’s dominion for himself and became what Jesus calls “the ruler of this world” (John 14:30). When Jesus came, he brought the kingdom of God and He expects His kingdom-minded people to take whatever action is needed to push back the long-standing kingdom of Satan and bring the peace and prosperity of His kingdom here on earth. This is what we mean by dominionism.

A theocracy. The usual meaning of theocracy is that a nation is run by authorized representatives of the church or its functional religious equivalent. Everyone I know in NAR would absolutely reject this idea, thinking back to Constantine’s failed experiment or some of the oppressive Islamic governments today. The way to achieve dominion is not to become “America’s Taliban,” but rather to have kingdom-minded people in every one of the Seven Mountains: Religion, Family, Education, Government, Media, Arts & Entertainment, and Business so that they can use their influence to create an environment in which the blessings and prosperity of the Kingdom of God can permeate all areas of society.

Extra-biblical revelation. Some object to the notion that God communicates directly with us, supposing that everything that God wanted to reveal He revealed in the Bible. This cannot be true, however, because there is nothing in the Bible that says it has 66 books. It actually took God a couple of hundred years to reveal to the church which writings should be included in the Bible and which should not. That is extra-biblical revelation. Even so, Catholics and Protestants still disagree on the number. Beyond that, I believe that prayer is two way, we speak to God and expect Him to speak with us. We can hear God’s voice. He also reveals new things to prophets as we have seen. The one major rule governing any new revelation from God is that it cannot contradict what has already been written in the Bible. It may supplement it, however.

Supernatural signs and wonders. I have a hard time understanding why some include this in their list of “heresies.” Whenever Jesus sent out His disciples he told them to heal the sick and cast out demons. Why we should expect that He has anything else in mind for us today is puzzling. True, this still pulls some traditionalists out of their comfort zones, but that just goes with the territory. One critic claimed that the NAR has excessive fixation on Satan and demonic spirits. This is purely a judgment call, and it may only mean that we cast out more demons than they do. So what?

Relational Structures

Some of the authors I read expressed certain frustrations because they found it difficult to get their arms around the NAR. They couldn’t find a top leader or even a leadership team. There was no newsletter. The NAR didn’t have an annual meeting. There was no printed doctrinal statement or code of ethics. This was very different from dealing with traditional denominations. The reason behind this is that, whereas denominations are legal structures, the NAR is a relational structure. Everyone is related to, or aligned, with an apostle or apostles. This alignment is voluntary. There is no legal tie that binds it. In fact, some have dual alignment or multiple alignment. Apostles are not in competition with each other, they are in cahoots. They do not seek the best for themselves, but for those who choose to align with them. If the spotlight comes on them, they will accept it, but they do not seek it.

The key to this? The mutual and overriding desire that “Your kingdom come, Your will be done on earth as it is in heaven!”

-end-

[1]http://www.forgottenword.org/leadershipevent.html

[2]http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/opinion/2011/07/20117259426336524.html

[3]David B. Barrett, et. al.,  eds., World Christian Encyclopedia,, Volume 1, Oxford UK: Oxford University Press, 2001, p. 4

Yet Another Healing Revival With No Healing

This was just brought to my attention

ABC/Nightline recently did a show on yet another healing revival currently underway in Mobile, Alabama. You may recognize these practices –  the endless “worship” the laying on of hands to the forehead, people falling down, speaking in tongues, the name “John Kilpatrick” and the “Brownsville Revival”. You may also remember that Nightline did a show on Todd Bentley during the Lakeland Outpouring in which there were claims made of many who were healed and even raised from the dead. None of which were ever proven true. Now, don’t you think if this were the case the media would be all over it? We would still be hearing reports of healings througout the internet. And certainly if anyone was raised from the dead the news would resound to this day.

As you watch this video and hear the claims of healing remember Jesus healed all He touched or spoke to. The healing was immediate and complete at that same moment. There is not one instance that someone had to wait for more healing to manifest at a later date. When God healed it was without question and those around were witness to an absolute miracle.

This is not what we are seeing in this video, or in times past. These are not true healings! They are emotional outbursts, feelings, bodily sensations and counterfeit gifts created by the enemy. Whether they be demonic or psychological, the intention is to get the believer’s mind off the truth and on to their claims of the miraculous. And please, drop the cash in the bucket up in front. Healing incurs much expense.

Here’s your link –

Nightline: Turning to Revivals for Healing

The Global Revival is here whether we like it or not

Another great article from Kathleen exposing the dangers of the false prophetic movement, aka the Global Revival. (Don’t the words Global Revival just sound creepy???)

Let’s look at the teachings of scripture vs. the teaching in this revival.

2Timothy 4.1-4 says: I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom: preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction.  For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers  in accordance to their own desires, and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths.

Now instead of heeding this warning, many of these ministers including Bill Johnson of Bethel, Mike Bickle of IHOP, Patricia King of the Extreme Prophetic, Rick Joyner of Morningstar Ministries, are not teaching young believers to learn scripture and learn to rightfully divide the Word of Truth. They teach them that it is more important to experience “God’s love” and to listen to what he is “saying today.” They are taught to listen for prophetic words spoken to them by trained prophets. To listen to those who have been trained to be “led by the spirit.” They teach that people who have been trained in the supernatural are now able to be led by a new spirit. A spirit that is so new and so different that no one has a written guide book for this new thing God is doing. Those who are acting upon this new revelation are the “Radical glory forerunners”.

Don’t be fooled – Continue reading the truth….

The Global Revival

Roger Oakland Charismatic Deception

A youtube clip taken from Roger Oakland’s New Wine Babylonian Vine

When Bethel Invades Your Church

This is an article written by Kathleen Morgan who frequently commented here. She recently came out of the “Bethel Invasion”.  This is the link to her short story   When Bethel Invades Your Church.

As a child I was raised a Catholic, which included attending mass, catechism, and a first holy communion. As a young adult I read the Bible and decided to attend a charismatic Bible-based non-denominational church.

Eventually I left the charismatic church and attended a Baptist Church. I had never understood or been interested in the differences between the many denominations within the Christian Church.  This fuzzy attitude of mine has changed over the past year, and I would like to share my story with you.

My family’s experience at the local charismatic church

My adult daughter recently became involved in New Age and native spirituality.  After we had a few discussions and arguments over Christian beliefs and the practices of the New Age movement, she agreed to attend a local non-denominational church with me. As a family we had gone to a Baptist Church together, but I thought that under the circumstances a charismatic church would be a place that would suit the situation. I was hopeful that hearing the Scripture taught would reach her with the message of salvation.

To my surprise the Sunday sermons were less about Scripture and more about
the “revival” happening in the town of Redding, California, where the message of Bill Johnson, senior pastor of Bethel Church, was being preached. I heard about the students of Pastor Johnson’s School of the Supernatural and how they are being trained to bring God’s power and healing to us. I heard sermons laced with invitations to try “soaking prayer” and experience “fire tunnels.” I saw a speaker in church “downloading and processing messages from God.” There were invitations to receive God’s power and impartations of healing and prophetic words.

This church purchased curriculum from Bethel and invited “those who want to move forward with God” to attend. This was a class on “the supernatural,” the same signs and wonders of which the Apostles spoke.  Members of the Bethel Church traveled south in order to instruct people to “learn to have visions and dreams” from God. I was not comfortable with the subject matter and did not attend the class. The church also held a Bible Study fellowship and I asked my daughter to go with me.  She came several times and enjoyed the meetings. One night a woman give a talk about some kind of inner healing ministry she did with people. When she was finished speaking my daughter said, “Mom, this is what I am learning at the Healing Arts School; she is talking about what is in my book”.

Found on the Internet – Signs and Wonders?

Since that time I have grown very concerned with the emphasis on Bill Johnson and
Bethel.  I did research on it and found many articles and blogs full of praise for Bethel and the “new things God is doing.”  There are dozens of Youtube videos and blogs with statements like these: “During one of these meetings a leader in our church saw gold dust begin to appear on her hands. After the meeting she went home and the gold dust appeared again. She understood this sign to be an indicator to pray for her husband and for a visiting relative–both of them were healed. Her husband and her relative began to shout when gold dust appeared on their hands!”

The internet has countless intriguing, sensational, and supernatural stories of healings and gold teeth being imparted. I watched a Youtube video of gold dust stigmata appearing on hands, I saw hands and bibles dripping in oil and angel feathers falling from the rafters. Each time these accounts were attributed to God as “signs and wonders” of his unconditional love.

Modern Day Prophets?

These teachings are not coming solely from Bill Johnson, but they are part of a global alliance of modern day “apostolic and prophetic” persons. They claim to have been given impartations from God himself to prepare his church to usher in the New Heaven.  This is a vision shared by many people. The fabric of this “revival” is woven by dreams and visions of men and women who proclaim to know a deeper truth, much of it revealed to them by angels.

Many churches all over the world are partnering with Bethel and other “supernatural” congregations to bring the revival to your area. That statement alone is unnerving to me. There are schools of the supernatural opening up to teach young believers how to tap into God’s power.

I read enough of this phenomenon to make me have nightmares. Now I understand that this revival is happening whether we like it or not.

Responses from Other Christians

Astounded by all this, I called a few Christian friends that I have known for years. I asked if they knew about this “revival.”  I found a wide range of responses to my questions. Some are committed to this and believe my wariness comes from unbelief. Some think I still need to process the information. They honestly believe these new revelations are coming to us from God through “the corporate church.” Others think it is just weird, a fad of sorts. Then there are those who just ignore it, because they never gave credence to charismatic Christianity in the first place.

Where does that leave me?  After researching and experiencing it from a parishioner’s point of view, I find it full of man-made events and mystical occurrences. It troubles me enough to write this article and hope people will educate themselves on this subject. Many of the practices are taken from Shamanism and directly from pagan ceremonies. The ancient rituals hold some power and impart mesmerizing delusions. Christianity does not embrace the ceremonial rites of ancient religions. We preach Christ crucified, for the preaching of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

The Result of Sleeping Workers

Wow. Read this article I found this morning posted on Moriel.

Are You Sleeping or Awake?

Jesus presented another parable to them, saying, “The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field. But while his men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went away. But when the wheat sprouted and bore grain, then the tares became evident also. The slaves of the landowner came and said to him, ‘Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?’

“And he said to them, ‘An enemy has done this!’

“The slaves said to him, ‘Do you want us, then, to go and gather them up?’

“But he said, ‘No; for while you are gathering up the tares, you may uproot the wheat with them. Allow both to grow together until the harvest; and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, “First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up; but gather the wheat into my barn.”’”  (Matthew 13:24-30)

It is incredible that the enemy was provided the opportunity to sow the tares by the sleeping slaves, who in turn ask incredulously, “How did this happen? Could there be something wrong with the seed?” Although Jesus explains exactly what this parable means, many fail to learn one of the main lessons in the fact that the tares are allowed into the church not as the result of the will of God, but the negligence of the church itself. Having fallen asleep on our spiritual watch, Satan has been provided the opportunity to insert false believers into our midst.

I actually heard an extended sermon based on this parable which managed to omit this key fact by skipping past the opening verses and jumping right to Jesus’ words, “Allow both to grow together until the harvest”. Extracting and lifting this line out of the parable so he could twist the context, the speaker asserted that this meant it was by God’s design that good and evil are allowed to grow, side-by-side, co-equal to each other until His appointed time of judgment. Therefore, he further asserted, the application in his opinion was that no matter how bad things are, no matter how bad a ministry or person might be, there is always something “good” to be extracted or learned. His repeated admonishment was that we were not to be distracted by the presence of evil, but to instead look for the good that was in the vicinity of evil. (In seminary terms whereas the proper way to handle Scripture is through “exegesis” which seeks to bring out the intended meaning from the text, this is an example of “eisegesis” where someone introduces their own ideas and transposes them onto the text.)

Having provided this “platform”, he then proceeded to list a host of “good” things he had extracted from a myriad of sources. This exhaustive list of religious organizations included many which I would agree are impeccable in their quality and pedigree, but it also included a great many which were either dubious or outright cults or false religions. The amazing thing was how this speaker knew which ones would be controversial to the audience and often paused on them to reassure us, “Now I know these folks have some problems, and they wouldn’t be my number one recommendation, but if you can look past it, here’s some good that’s come from them.”

At the very least, this man was an example of the sleeping servants in the parable to whom it can be directly attributed that Satan is allowed to enter the church and plant false teaching. Even more so however, he might be an example of a false shepherd who actually allows God’s flock to be spiritually attacked and harmed. What we have to take seriously are the many warnings from Christ and the Apostles that we are supposed to remain vigilant against these false teachers/believers so that neither we nor the church at large will be deceived or go astray because of them.

“Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood. I know that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock; and from among your own selves men will arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away the disciples after them. Therefore be on the alert, remembering that night and day for a period of three years I did not cease to admonish each one with tears. (Acts 20:28-31)

It might be inevitable that evil and wickedness will come and attempt to establish itself within our fellowships and organizations, but it is not necessarily a given that they should be accepted or allowed inevitable entrance. It is clear that we have the biblical responsibility to make every good faith effort to detect, warn, and guard against them at every turn.

And yet this attitude of “Eat the meat and spit out the bones” is one of the most prevalent problems in the church today. We see it when someone suggests we implement the “good” parts of the Purpose Driven Church, or apply the “good” approaches to worship employed by the Emergent Church, or make use of the “good” points raised by Rick Warren, Joel Osteen, Brian McLaren or a host of others on a list of false teachers too long to mention here. Personally I think because there is little or no emphasis on what it means to serve and worship a “holy” God, the majority no longer understand the biblical teaching that God hates a mixture.

But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves. (2 Peter 2:1)

The image that this phrase is trying to convey is laying truth side-by-side next to error. In other words, truth is used to camouflage error. This situation is explained in the most classical manner by asking the question, “Would you drink a glass of water which only had one drop of poison in it?” This is the problem with false teaching; some truth is present in order to sell the lie. But it all becomes tainted in the end. This is why Paul goes out of his way to state…

For our exhortation does not come from error or impurity or by way of deceit; but just as we have been approved by God to be entrusted with the gospel, so we speak, not as pleasing men, but God who examines our hearts. (1 Thessalonians 2:3-4)

So how are we to deal with false teachers and their false teachings? Pick out the “good” from the “bad”? Throughout Scripture we have repeated and plentiful examples of how to deal with such people. They are to be plainly, directly, and even publicly confronted so that there is no doubt as to their true nature. We see this in David’s calling out of Saul, Jeremiah’s dealings with Hananiah, Christ’s interaction with the corrupt religious leaders of the day, and throughout the New Testament epistles wherein the writers actually name the names of false teachers and publicly warn against associating with them.

Yes, it is true that if sin occurs in the course of a personal relationship with a brother or sister in Christ that the biblical process is to go first to them privately and initiate a process of reconciliation. (Mt. 18:15-20) However, this is NOT the process to follow in dealing with false teachers, false prophets, false apostles, false leaders, or false shepherds. Nowhere in Scripture – not even by Christ Himself – are they dealt with in any manner other than openly, directly, and publicly. A good watchman sounds an alarm; he does not first go out to the enemy to see if he can “work it out” with them. A good shepherd defends the flock; he does not attempt to make friends with the wolves and have a sleepover with the sheep.

Now the man in the real-life example I opened this discussion with was, in actuality, a very nice guy. It is not like he showed up in a Halloween costume dressed as the devil with a pitchfork and started screaming and attacking people. He was sincere, educated, articulate, even humble in the outward presentation of himself. (Something Warren, Osteen, McLaren and their ilk all have in common.) But we cannot allow such superficial appearances to cloud our judgment and subsequent course of action, which we always measure against God’s Word and God’s Word alone.

But what I am doing I will continue to do, so that I may cut off opportunity from those who desire an opportunity to be regarded just as we are in the matter about which they are boasting. For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their deeds. (1 Corinthians 11:12-15)

This is why they are so difficult to spot initially, their appearance and demeanor as tares so closely mimicking the wheat. In the parable, the servants did not even notice the problem until “the wheat sprouted and bore grain, then the tares became evident also.” Biologists tell us this is the exact nature of this real-life look-alike, that while it grows it looks exactly like wheat until it blossoms and bears fruit, at which time it is plainly obvious which is the wheat and which is the tare. By this we have another clue as to how to recognize those who are actually false: by their fruit.

“For there is no good tree which produces bad fruit, nor, on the other hand, a bad tree which produces good fruit. For each tree is known by its own fruit. For men do not gather figs from thorns, nor do they pick grapes from a briar bush. The good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth what is good; and the evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth what is evil; for his mouth speaks from that which fills his heart. (Luke 6:43-45)

There is a word in this politically correct world which has made inroads into our thinking which actually has no biblical standing according to the world’s definition: “tolerate”. Paul uses it in 2 Corinthians 11:19-20 to chastise Christians for tolerating false teachers and their teaching, and Jesus uses it in Revelation 2:20 to admonish Thyatira for tolerating the false teacher Jezebel. Its only “positive” use, if you will, is by Christ to the church in Ephesus:

‘I know your deeds and your toil and perseverance, and that you cannot tolerate evil men, and you put to the test those who call themselves apostles, and they are not, and you found them to be false; (Revelation 2:2)

What the world would have us implement is a definition of tolerance that is completely opposite that propounded by God’s Word. In each instance it refers directly to false teachers and the need to be resolutely INtolerant.

I suppose it really does come down to our faith in God’s Word. The only explanation for this repeated behavior to supplement God’s Word and ways with information, approaches, and philosophies poisoned by the influences of the world is a lack of faith in God’s Word to provide the whole answer. This is probably why the charlatans like Warren, Osteen, and McLaren ignore the Word or use the worst imitations of it in order to camouflage their “destructive heresies”. It is a palpable lack of faith in God’s Word which leads to thinking that marketing principles can provide additional insight into how to build a church. It is a lack of faith in God’s Word which leads to thinking that secular music models can become the basis for worship. It is a lack of faith in God’s Word which leads to thinking that we can “borrow” things from cults and false religions with no perceived ill effect.

The Old Testament Law forbade making a garment out of linen mixed with wool (Dt. 22:11), an example of the natural being grafted with the manmade. “A little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough”, (1 Co. 5:6) keeping in mind that leaven is the biblical symbol not only of sin but false teaching. Or my favorite in this category, “Dead flies make the perfumer’s oil stink”. (Ecc. 10:1) God demands a higher standard because of His very nature. “By those who come near Me I will be treated as holy”. (Lev. 10:3) How can anything outside of God’s Word even begin to teach the concept of holiness much less provide additional insight into how to attain it?

In fact, when God’s people find themselves in the worst spiritual environments, in those places such as Babylon, the embodiment of the world system which would absorb us completely if it could, the repeated admonition is to leave and come out.

Depart, depart, go out from there,
Touch nothing unclean;
Go out of the midst of her, purify yourselves,
You who carry the vessels of the LORD. (Isaiah 52:11)

We applied healing to Babylon, but she was not healed;
Forsake her and let us each go to his own country,
For her judgment has reached to heaven
And towers up to the very skies. (Jeremiah 51:9)

“Therefore, come out from their midst and be separate,” says the Lord. “And do not touch what is unclean; And I will welcome you. (2 Corinthians 6:17)

I heard another voice from heaven, saying, “Come out of her, my people, so that you will not participate in her sins and receive of her plagues; (Revelation 18:4)

This is no longer just about the individual false teachers anymore. I honestly think we have passed the time when it is still possible to debate and perhaps save the movements, organizations, and even denominations we have witnessed poison themselves with their embrace of false teaching and false teachers. I believe the reason one of the strongest movements within Western Evangelical Bible-believing Christianity in the forming of house churches and independent fellowships is that God is literally calling His people out of Babylon. Those still lingering behind seem all too often to be the ones clinging to the notion that they can still glean the “good” from the “bad”. To fight for the unconditional return to the cross and God’s Word and ways is a noble pursuit if that is what God has called you to do. But if someone is staying because there might still be some “good” left among the rubble?

We have been witnessing this boil over in the Calvary Chapel movement of late, one of the longest and strongest results of the last legitimate spiritual revival of more than 40 years ago. Today we can measure each individual Calvary Chapel by its bookstore. Those trying to glean the “good” from the “bad” will host a plethora of materials from indisputable church growth, Ecumenical, Emergent, and even New Age false teachers. Such materials are strikingly absent from the bookstores of those still clinging to the sole authority of God’s Word. We see conflicting signals when some of its churches and leaders publicly stand up to these false influences while others hold conferences inviting them in through the front door or appearing side-by-side with them on television. Will the servants go to sleep and allow the enemy to plant the tares? We have already seen this occur with Methodists, Baptists, Nazarenes, Assemblies of God and a heart-breaking long list of others. If the battle should be lost for the whole, it will be followed by God calling the remnant out of Babylon. Even Calvary Chapel.

It all begins and is held together by God’s Truth and built into a whole by our pursuit of sanctification, the process by which holiness is effected in each believer’s life. And as His watchmen and shepherds on behalf of the entire flock we need to be able to effectively wield His Word. But a real-life shepherd would never consider for a second that the wolf should be “tolerated” and that there might be some “good” that can be extracted from allowing it access to the flock. Neither should we. Even if it means taking the flock to another pasture entirely.

In His Love,
Servant@WalkWithTheWord.org

The Alignment of Political America and the NAR

I’ve been watching and writing about the heretical teachings of the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) for a few months, not being sure why it seemed to be so important to do so. I don’t have a lot of experience with them because I never really “got” Chuck Pierce at all. However, there are some other prophets and apostles in this madhouse that I did follow (Cal Pierce, Cindy Jacobs, Dutch Sheets) and I guess that was enough for the Lord to impress on me the need for exposure.

Last night I began to come across some very good information offered by organizations who have researched the NAR much longer than I have. I am stunned to see the newly formed connection between political America and the demonic agenda of the NAR. No longer can it be confined only to a strange few. Follow the links I posted below – read and listen with great care. Yes, it will take some time as there is a lot of information. But, so important. You will see the connection between C Peter Wagner’s NAR and some of our government officials under the guise of patriotism and Godly values. It is time for great concern for those who will not join this movement, this building of a whole new “kingdom”.  Suddenly I understand the comments I read by those who were greatly concerned about Wilderness Outcry. What will this lead to? Are we ready to stand?

Now to Him who is able to keep you from stumbling, and present you faultless before the presence of His glory with exceeding joy, to God our Savior Who alone is wise, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and forever. Amen. Jude 24-25

Apprising Ministries -Mayday and the New Apostolic Reformation

In response to the May Day event held this past Saturday at the Lincoln Memorial, Ingrid (Schlueter) and Sarah (Leslie) brought to listener attention a movement known as the New Apostolic Reformation. This title was coined by C. Peter Wagner during the 1990’s.

Featuring teachers such as Dutch Sheets, Cindy Jacobs and false prophetess Stacy Campbell, the New Apostolic Reformation is centered around a theology of dominionism. It teaches that Christians can take down demonic spirits in order to take back territories and institutions for Christ. The movement is post-millennial believing that Jesus will not return until Christians take over the 7 Mountains.

These “mountains” are institutions like the media, entertainment, the economy, etc. In other words, their eschatology requires that instead of reaching people with the gospel one heart at a time, they believe they are to conquer the earth one demonic spirit at a time and make the earth perfect so that Jesus can return. (Online source)

You can download and/or listen to this Crosstalk program right here.

Right Wing Watch – Mayday on the Mall

May Day 2010 has been organized around the “Seven Mountains” theology, which advocates the complete takeover of every aspect of contemporary culture by modern day “apostles” of Christ. The theology is rooted in the belief that Christians are meant to have dominion over literally everything and is focused on spiritually “invading” seven specific facets of modern life in order to wrest control away from Satan and his demonic spirits so that Christians can put them to use in bringing about God’s kingdom on Earth: (1) Business; (2) Government; (3) Media; (4) Arts and Entertainment; (5) Education; (6) Family; and (7) Religion.

Herescope :

The Coalescing of the Christian Right with Apostolic Dominion

The American political landscape has suddenly changed. A tumult is appearing in the land with the passage of health care reform. The Christian Right, with its years of courting political influence, is now poised to merge with the new Tea Party Movement. In times of crisis, natural or caused, things seem to happen faster and opportunities, that would take years, seem to happen in months. There is the scent of rebellion in the air.

R&R Revival and Revolt

Initially The Tea Party was populist, libertarian, limited government, anti-socialism and lower taxes, etc. But the first ever National Tea Party Conference in Nashville in February revealed that there has always been an overlap with Christian Right social issues. The Tea Party movement is in danger of being co-opted by the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) and its radical agenda. Do the Tea Party folks realize what they are getting into?

More on the Outcry

I’ve recently found out that Against the Outcry (a group blog who spoke out against Dutch Sheets’ Wilderness Outcry and who posted some of my articles) will be closing their blog soon . Since the Wilderness Outcry has been canceled, the blog has served it’s purpose. If you have been planning on doing some reading but haven’t made it over there yet you may want to visit soon before it is gone.

update – Against the Outcry is no longer available and has been removed from my blogroll since the writing of this article.

It has been our hope and prayer that those following Dutch would have had the opportunity to view the material posted and have seen the truth. It has been said that there is a group of “intercessors” who have claimed a new purpose in going to “god” to find out who was behind that effort. This is nothing short of evil. And to raise up a group of intercessors for the purpose of what… I cannot say or imagine what they are thinking! Where could this lead?

And as a side note, good for them! As Americans they have the right to stand against this craziness coming to their own city, to stand and say this will not happen where I live and work and pay taxes, this will not happen where I raise my children!

Please pray for the safety of those involved and for the salvation of those who participated  purely for domestic reasons and do not know Christ. What must it look like when groups like these come in the name of Christ and yet do not speak His gospel, yet speak of an effort to take over the country, forcing others to join..or…what…be imprisoned…die?  This  has been the concern of some who have spoken against this gathering of Dutch’s followers. They wonder what will become of them if they do not join forces and “convert”.  How much does this resemble Islam? How about socialism?

My reasons  for speaking against this movement and the NAR as a whole can be found throughout my blog, so I won’t restate them here. I can say the cancellation of this meeting was in fact an answer to prayer. What right does this group have to instill fear in the minds and hearts of those who believe differently than they? What right do they have to twist the meaning of the gospel – the very reason Christ died – for their own realized fulfillment of some dream or vision?

What is Christianity coming to?

For anyone reading with this same concern, please know that it is not the way of Jesus Christ to force His teachings on anyone. We have all been given a free will to decide whether or not to follow Christ.  In His own words He told His disciples that His kingdom is not of this world.  And so anyone supporting a dominion  – take over the country or world for the sake of holiness /righteousness/purity – viewpoint has not come in the name of Christ, no matter what else they say.

But Christ did die, for all of us. And one day their will be a judgment of how we lived our lives and who for. So I beg you, on that day find yourselves counted among those who stood for Christ!

John 18:36 My Kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world my servants would fight so that I would not be delivered unto the Jews. But now My kingdom is not from here.

Romans 5:8  But God demonstrates His own love for us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

John 14:6 I am the way, the truth and the life. No man comes to the Father except through Me.

Revelation 22:12 And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work.

America and Christianity, a Parallel Slide Into Secret Places

This morning I’m considering the upcoming National Day of Prayer-what is slowly becoming America as Christianity slowly becomes something else. They seem to both be in parallel  state of change as neither has the appearance of what it once was or should still be.

America, heralded for so long as a country planted on Christian principles, established for the purpose of not only “religious” freedom, but one in which its people could freely worship God in the name of Jesus Christ. One in which its people would be free from religious prosecution, free to live the words of the bible, free to pray, free to worship in spirit and in truth. Without getting too far off here, I have to say I believe that to a degree as history proves that a group came from England for this very reason. But I also believe there were other groups establishing this country, who used the guise of Christianity, or at least the name of “God” and had a completely different plan,  one not of freedom, but of secrets. America having Christian roots is only partly true, but that is another topic for another time.

The National Day of Prayer was created by Congress in 1952. Since that time each of our presidents have honored and acknowledged that day as one for prayer.  This should be a good thing, right? All Christians coming together in various locations or in spirit to pray against the moral decay of our country and to pray for it’s leaders. It sounds like a good thing. Unfortunately, I have learned the hard way what seems to be Christian prayer isn’t necessarily.

With all that we have seen, and attributed to the great falling away, or the great apostasy, we know Christianity is under siege. I don’t know how else to say it. With the continued rising of the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR), the influence of Bethel (Bill Johnson), Morningstar (Rick Joyner and Todd Bentley), the International House of Prayer (Mike Bickle), The Call (Lou Engle),  and the influences of the Emergent Church (Brian McLaren, Richard Foster, Dallas Willard, Rob Bell, etc.), Saddleback (Rick Warren), the Word of Faith, Charismanina, Christianity as taught in the word of God is not up to par in this land. We have also seen, as I have warned about, many modes of “prayer” that we have been exposed to and taught are not modes of biblical prayer.

How  many of us have watched in horror as we have realized our churches are part of these supporters and even participants and teachers of false doctrines and methods? How many of us who once believed we knew the truth came to realize how far off  we really were? How many of us have watched our churches which at one time did not support these ways become taken in by them? I know there have been many. I’ve had quite a few commentors here say just that very thing. If you are one of them, know that my heart went out to you at that news and I have prayed for you and your church. I don’t take my readers lightly or for granted. You are dear to me as I know many of you are searching for the truth in the information I put up on my blog, as I once was too!

Some would say I am too focused on the negative. And to that I would say look at where we are at now. Look at the shipwreck of our faith, the very thing we were given to uphold and protect. Where is Christianity? It is being morphed into something else. So, while I am found to “find fault in everything”, I say where is the truth? If the Apostle Paul was to walk into any of these meeting places and hear the heresy, I dare to say some tables would overturn, in fact, if there would ever be a spiritual cause for an earthquake there it would be.  This is why I will not stand side by side with these false apostles and prophets under a guise of Christian prayer. And this is what we are seeing today in the upcoming National Day of Prayer.

Here is the link to their “ministry partners“.  Who are they? The International House of Prayer!!! The Call!!!  How about a little feel good wisdom from the wife of Normal Vincent Peale, Ruth Stafford Peale? I’m just wondering – where’s the yoga? Think that’s an outrageous question? It’s not far off, in light of the truth behind contemplative prayer’s roots in eastern mysticism found at IHOP, and the Emergent Church, taught innocently on the “Be Still” DVD.

We’ve already seen as I’ve written about the truth in the upcoming MayDay 2010 in which James Dobson joined forces with the NAR. So, am I surprised the National Day of Prayer has gone as far south? No. We’ve seen the push from Lou Engle and Dutch Sheets in the upcoming “Wilderness Outcry”, and Cindy Jacobs’ “Awakening”.

Listen, no one needs to grant us a day to pray. We pray because Jesus told us to pray, and He taught us how. Prayer should never be handled so lightly or so carelessly that is it a one day event, or as we have been seeing, a show. What is one day out of 365 anyway? What does that accomplish if the very next day all those who participated drift back into spiritual semi-consciousness without another thought of prayer?

If we are truly going to turn this nation, if that can even be done, or if it is the will of our Lord, we must change it through the hearts of it’s citizen’s through individual repentance. And that must start with Christians taking a stand against these who have come to steal away the true Faith!  America is indeed in meltdown, and Christianity along with it. And after all of these “days of prayer” I see just the opposite of what they’ve proposed. I see a steadfast decline in the leadership of our country and in the leadership of our churches and certainly a moral decline in both.

I see America drifting further and further away from its so called Christian roots and its established freedoms, and Christianity away from biblical truth. I have to wonder if the two don’t go hand in hand. As I mentioned in the beginning, some organizations and agendas in America were established long ago in secret. The same is to be said of the so called Christian organizations I spoke of here. They come in the name of the Lord, but after that are secrets. And, it is in what is not being said, or that which is not recognized as false that is the most dangerous.

So to steal their National Day of Prayer tag line, “For such a time as this”, let me say yes, for such a time has come to take a stand for all that is true, for Christ and our faith. It is time to expose these liars for what they are and to demand our churches and faith remains pure. For if Americans can see the erosion of their rights and freedoms, surely true Christians can see the same in regard to their faith. America is slipping away, as is Christianity, right before our very eyes. The truth for America is written in the pages of our constitution, just as the truth of Christianity is written in the pages of our bibles! Have we bothered to read or understand either of them? Or have we been taken in by lies forged in dark places?

I say “Father, Your will be done in this land, for You are sovereign”. I will pray on this day as I do on others. It will be a struggle, a discipline as it always is. However, I will not stand and approach my Father with these liars. I will stand against them in His courts for such a time as this, and if one day I perish, then so be it the will of my Father. Because I would much rather die with His words on my lips and His truth in my heart, than to be seen in “unity” with a well disguised wolf.

Word of Faith No More

The following video was recorded a couple of years ago by John Edwards, a fellow blogger aka Junker Jorge. John is an ex Word of Faith Pastor who was trained under Kenneth Hagin. For those whose computers don’t do videos well, I’ve transcribed his message word for word below. Be blessed!

Thanks John! Praise God for your willingness to warn others of this dangerous teaching.

Hey guys! My name is John Edwards.  I’m a Rhema Graduate. I went to Rhema Bible Training Center in 96-98 and I was ordained by Kenneth Hagin and came to Alabama, started a church called The Edge then we changed the name to Hillside Church.

About January of 2008 I decided to leave the Word of Faith Movement. What I want to do is to put together a series of YouTubes; I want to help people out there who are trapped in the Word of Faith.

Word of Faith is a dangerous, cultic movement. And it’s so similar to the new age message that it’s right there beside it – and it sucks you in. Word of Faith – what attracted me to it is that I thought I could have a say in my life. I always had fear of maybe losing my kids or getting cancer or going bankrupt. I heard the Word of Faith message as it was presented by Kenneth Hagin and it gave me hope that I could have a say for my life.

And the dangerous thing about the Word of Faith is that it puts the believer in the driver’s seat and it puts God and His will and His plan for your life in the back seat.  The whole Word of Faith movement is based on one passage of scripture in Mark chapter 11, verse 23, Jesus said “Whosoever shall say to until this mountain be thou removed and be thou cast into the sea and shall not doubt in his heart thou shall believe those things that he sayeth, the things shall come to pass and he shall have whatsoever he said”.

Now what they did – Jesus was a Jewish Rabbi; He spoke in Aramaic. And a real popular teaching idiom back then in that culture was a phrase “moving a mountain”. It meant to cut through red tape, it meant to do the impossible with God. And Jesus was using a hyperbole in His teaching. It was an on- purpose exaggeration. You know where Jesus said if your eye causes you to sin to pluck it out, and He talked about hating your mother or father in comparing to loving Him? He doesn’t really want you to hate your mother or dad or pull your eyeballs out, He’s just using an exaggeration to prove a point on purpose to show how powerful faith is.

When Jesus was talking to his disciples and said “If you say to the mountain move -and it will move if you believe and not doubt”.  His disciples had sense enough to know He was using an exaggeration to show them an example of the power of faith. Now what the faith preachers did- namely Kenneth Hagan whom I love, I went through the school, I’m not mad at him, but he was wrong. What they did is they made a science of every little word that Jesus said as hyperbole; they made a science on it. What the Word of Faith does is that it teaches you that you can have what you say. They take that last phrase that Jesus said “he shall have whosoever he said” and made a whole religion on how to get everything you need from God. And the dangerous thing about it is that it puts fear in the believer.

Word of Faith people are the most legalistic, paranoid, superstitious, in-bondage people I have ever known in my life. And you know what?  I’m part of the problem!  I preached the heresy for eight years. I taught people they could have what they say, and that’s not what Jesus said. At the most what Jesus said that you will have what you say to the mountain.

But Word of Faith teachers and Word of Faith Christians actually believe that whatever comes out of your mouth is actually going to happen. For instance, if you say” oh my back’s killing me”, they believe you’re going to develop cancer of the spine or something. If you say “oh my heads killing me” they’ll think you’re gonna get a brain tumor. They believe that your words will create entities in themselves and they’re not.

Your words are powerful. I can cuss you out with my words and make you mad. I can tell jokes and make you laugh. I can build you up or I can cut you down. But I cannot create things with my words as is taught by the Word of Faith. So the new age message, this humanism message is that man is God, that we all together as man we are God.  We can do anything.  We have our own wisdom and our own life.  The Word of Faith message is very, very similar. It tricks you into thinking you’re in control of your life. You are in control of your destiny. I know because I taught this for many years. It’s a cult. It was founded on cultic principles.

E.W. Kenyon was a Baptist preacher who was very involved in new age and new thought and metaphysics. He went to a school in Boston that was covered up with new age and new thought.  If you’ve heard about the new book called The Secret, if you’ve ever watched that – it’s new age – it’s humanism- it’s garbage– it’s counterfeit Christianity. It’s a counterfeit faith. Okay? And EW Kenyon took the principles of the new age, the new thought, The Secret, metaphysics and he blended it in with the bible to make another gospel – the gospel of me, the gospel of my words.

And the Word of Faith was then picked up by Kenneth Hagin who took Kenyon’s writings and then expanded on them. And the dangerous thing about the Word of Faith is it’s all centered on the power of your words, being the prophet of your own life, you, as a human, being in control of your destiny.

It’s also a very materialistic, money-minded movement. You can go to any Word of Faith preacher or TV or any Word of Faith church and they can’t preach for 10 minutes without talking about money.  They’re obsessed with money, they’re obsessed with wealth, they’re obsessed with cars and rings, and big churches and TV’s and helicopters and jets.  It’s a dangerous movement, folks. There’s a lot of deception there.

The Word of Faith as it’s taught by Word of Faith preachers today, Kenneth Hagin, Michael Murdock, people taught like I did. I’m John Edwards, I know you never heard of me, but I taught it. Its not the new covenant, it’s not the New Testament. It’s a delusion, it is a lie, and it is a twist of scriptures.  It’s designed to get your heart and your mind off of Jesus, off of the kingdom of God and on onto your bank account and on to your words. It produces fear, bondage and legalism. It’s counterfeit. It’s not the New Testament. The New Testament is about God loving you in your sins and sending Jesus His Son to die for you so that you can believe in Him and be borne again. To have all your sins forgiven, removed forgotten, so that you can have a personal Father – son, Father – daughter relationship with Almighty God to help you through life to give you the peace you need, to help you with your problems. And it’s about having eternal life.  When you die you go to live with God the Father and Jesus in heaven forever. That is the good news; that is the gospel.

But the Word of Faith preachers have turned it around into a self help gospel of me. And what I want you to do is get you a New Testament, go to a Christian book store and buy the New Testament on CD and just listen to it. Just listen to the word of God. It’s a new covenant. It’s not a covenant of prosperity, health and wealth.  It’s a covenant of dying to yourself to love others, to serve others. It’s a gospel of spreading God’s love to everyone. When you put others first, you love your neighbor as yourself. You put God first, you put Jesus first. You do have a God that will meet your needs. You do have a God that will heal your body, but Him meeting your needs and Him healing your body- that’s just a small part of the big truth of your redemption.

The Word of Faith is like putting a frog in a pot of water and turning the heat up, just start boiling the water, and he’s swimming around, and kicking around and he doesn’t know anything’s wrong! And before you know it –he’s cooked!  That’s what happened to me!  I started out wanting wanted to get The Faith.  Why? So I could love God more? No. So I could be in control of my life. Look. I learned. I don’t want to be in control of my life, I want Jesus in charge of my life.

So, please come back and have a look at some more of these later.

God bless you.

I’m John Edwards

Bye-bye

*****

Additional articles exposing Word of Faith heresy:

More on Kenneth Hagin by John

Testimony on WOF by John’s Brother Hank

Article on Sweat Lodge Deaths by Jackie Alnor